Jump to content


Photo

Question on B Series (Vented or non-vented)


  • Please log in to reply
23 replies to this topic

#1 lasapcheong

lasapcheong

    Occasional Poster

  • Forum Member
  • PipPip
  • 98 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Singapore

Posted 13 August 2007 - 10:46 PM

Hi,

I'm interested in getting a B-series and I'm deliberating between a vented or a non vented version.

Though where I live is near the ocean and I have no worries for lack of solid wind (10 to +15 mph on a good day), the reality is sometimes the winds can drop down to a miserable 2 - 5 mph during certain times of the year. While I appreciate the finess and "tunability" of the B-series from the mix of LE in the bag, I'm really interested in how it will perform under extremely light wind conditions. Would the vented sail cause the Rev to lose its lift compared to a non-vented under very light wind conditions?

I have no issue with fighting the pull when the wind picks up on a non-vented, rather than having to struggle getting it off the ground under light wind conditions. While on the subject of this, I"m also curious how the B-series would compare to a Rev 1.5 SUL under light wind conditions.

I know the kiting mantra in that in light wind flying, its more about the flyer then the kite itself but I"m trying to at least set myself up with a better advantage at first so I can enjoy my Rev whole year round :)

Any advice appreciated

Thanks!
Darryl

#2 Kitelife

Kitelife

    Forum Guru

  • Forum Host
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,934 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Portland, OR USA

Posted 13 August 2007 - 11:24 PM

Hi Darryl,

The B-Series vented will fly down to 4-5 mph with a 2 wrap frame (not included), but it's a bit sluggish until you hit the 6-7 mph range... Definitely not as much lift as a standard sail, nature of the beast, holes and all.

I've heard from others that the B-Series standard (using the lighter of the 2 frames) has a fairly comparable wind range to the SUL, but with the latter you'd have adjustable tuning on the handles, a heavier frame as well (you can combine the two leading edges for added strength), etc... All for less than the cost of an SUL with an added frame.

Just my 2 cents, I'll be curious to read experiences from others.

John Barresi

johnbarresi.com | kitelife.com | learnkites.com | teamiquad.comkitemap.org
youtube.com/kitelife | facebook.com/kitelifemagazine | KiteLife on Google+

 

President - American Kitefliers Association

"We cannot direct the wind, but we can adjust the sails."
(found in a fortune cookie - possibly an Einstein quote)

My full list of kite articles - kitelife.com/author/john-barresi
 

Please reward posts that are helpful, give positive reputation by clicking on "Like This" button on the right side of each post.


#3 FortFlyer

FortFlyer

    Jimi Quadsticks

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,405 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Bedford Ma. USA

Posted 13 August 2007 - 11:31 PM

OK here's an idea for those of you that have both, A Vented B-Series with Race Rod's.

how low can you go challenge :kid_smartass:
Jim,
Ft. Taber Park & Brenton Point

Rev's are like a carbon framed out-of-body experience

Posted Image

#4 Kitelife

Kitelife

    Forum Guru

  • Forum Host
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,934 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Portland, OR USA

Posted 14 August 2007 - 12:05 AM

iQuad has been using that combo at both Berkeley (10-15 mph) and Summer Heat (3-10 mph)...

We switched off to the standard sails at Summer Heat when the wind got under 5-6 mph, but found the vented/race spar combo to be the most versatile set up overall.

Very, very nice... Especially on 50# lines, 10 mph and less.

John Barresi

johnbarresi.com | kitelife.com | learnkites.com | teamiquad.comkitemap.org
youtube.com/kitelife | facebook.com/kitelifemagazine | KiteLife on Google+

 

President - American Kitefliers Association

"We cannot direct the wind, but we can adjust the sails."
(found in a fortune cookie - possibly an Einstein quote)

My full list of kite articles - kitelife.com/author/john-barresi
 

Please reward posts that are helpful, give positive reputation by clicking on "Like This" button on the right side of each post.


#5 Andy L

Andy L
  • Forum Member
  • 38 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manchester, UK

Posted 14 August 2007 - 12:34 AM

Hi,

I'm interested in getting a B-series and I'm deliberating between a vented or a non vented version.

Though where I live is near the ocean and I have no worries for lack of solid wind (10 to +15 mph on a good day), the reality is sometimes the winds can drop down to a miserable 2 - 5 mph during certain times of the year. While I appreciate the finess and "tunability" of the B-series from the mix of LE in the bag, I'm really interested in how it will perform under extremely light wind conditions. Would the vented sail cause the Rev to lose its lift compared to a non-vented under very light wind conditions?

I have no issue with fighting the pull when the wind picks up on a non-vented, rather than having to struggle getting it off the ground under light wind conditions. While on the subject of this, I"m also curious how the B-series would compare to a Rev 1.5 SUL under light wind conditions.

I know the kiting mantra in that in light wind flying, its more about the flyer then the kite itself but I"m trying to at least set myself up with a better advantage at first so I can enjoy my Rev whole year round :)

Any advice appreciated

Thanks!
Darryl


Hi Darryl,

From my experience (3 weeks worth) of both the vented and none vented b-series. I have to say that in any winds above 10-12 mph the vented is much nicer to fly. It is just that much more smoother and precise to fly. While the standard b-series is a fantastic kite, I think that if the winds are more often above 12 mph where you fly then you would be better off getting a vented b-series and then possibly just ordering a standard (non vented) sail direct from rev or through your local supplier. Or as FortFlyer says you could get some race rods.

Andy

#6 Watty

Watty

    Forum Veteran

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,867 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Vancouver, WA

Posted 14 August 2007 - 08:06 AM

I would suggest you get a vented, then get either a 2 wrap or a race spar frme for it.You would get much more fly time out of it instead of the std. Eventually I would of course suggest getting both. Then you alwayse have a B-series to fly ;)

Spence "Watty" Watson

Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image

 


#7 AdventureAng

AdventureAng

    Regular Poster

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 473 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:New Jersey

Posted 14 August 2007 - 09:55 AM

Hi Darryl,

From my experience (3 weeks worth) of both the vented and none vented b-series. I have to say that in any winds above 10-12 mph the vented is much nicer to fly. It is just that much more smoother and precise to fly. While the standard b-series is a fantastic kite, I think that if the winds are more often above 12 mph where you fly then you would be better off getting a vented b-series and then possibly just ordering a standard (non vented) sail direct from rev or through your local supplier. Or as FortFlyer says you could get some race rods.

Andy


I've only flown a vented once (this past weekend) and I fell in love. THe winds were starting to get strong and the non-vented B-series was a little too much for me to handel so my friend Antman let me take his vented out for a spin. I couldn't believe how nicely it flew. It didn't matter how gusty the wind was, or that it was blowing at 15-17 mph, it was stable as could be. I would strongly suggest getting a vented if you're in an area where there is a lot of wind. I'm going to start checking all my pockets for some extra change and with any luck, I'll gather enough to buy a vented. Either that, or my boyfriend can buy me one. hehehehe. I think I remember him saying somethin gabout wanting to get matching vented revs*. Wouldn't that be sweet.

*NOTE: BOYFREIND NEVER MENTIONED SAID THING, HOWEVER I'M HOPING THAT I CAN CONVINCE HIM OTHERWISE. MAYBE I'LL BAT MY EYES A COUPLE OF TIMES :-)
~AdventureAng
Happy flying to everybody. Now get off the computer and get a kite out! hehe

#8 Watty

Watty

    Forum Veteran

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,867 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Vancouver, WA

Posted 14 August 2007 - 07:31 PM

I've only flown a vented once (this past weekend) and I fell in love. THe winds were starting to get strong and the non-vented B-series was a little too much for me to handel so my friend Antman let me take his vented out for a spin. I couldn't believe how nicely it flew. It didn't matter how gusty the wind was, or that it was blowing at 15-17 mph, it was stable as could be. I would strongly suggest getting a vented if you're in an area where there is a lot of wind. I'm going to start checking all my pockets for some extra change and with any luck, I'll gather enough to buy a vented. Either that, or my boyfriend can buy me one. hehehehe. I think I remember him saying somethin gabout wanting to get matching vented revs*. Wouldn't that be sweet.

*NOTE: BOYFREIND NEVER MENTIONED SAID THING, HOWEVER I'M HOPING THAT I CAN CONVINCE HIM OTHERWISE. MAYBE I'LL BAT MY EYES A COUPLE OF TIMES :-)



Ant finally gut that B-Series huh? Sweet. And you tell no lies. The Vented is absolutately great to fly.

Spence "Watty" Watson

Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image

 


#9 FortFlyer

FortFlyer

    Jimi Quadsticks

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,405 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Bedford Ma. USA

Posted 14 August 2007 - 08:20 PM

Ant finally gut that B-Series huh? Sweet. And you tell no lies. The Vented is absolutately great to fly.


I think Ang is talking about the Red White & Blue standard vented that Antman has.
Jim,
Ft. Taber Park & Brenton Point

Rev's are like a carbon framed out-of-body experience

Posted Image

#10 AdventureAng

AdventureAng

    Regular Poster

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 473 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:New Jersey

Posted 15 August 2007 - 05:40 AM

I think Ang is talking about the Red White & Blue standard vented that Antman has.



Yeah, I'm talking about his red, white, and blue one. That kite flies like a dream. He really wants a B-seriers and I think that's a good idea because maybe he'll terrorize telephone poles with his OWN kite instead of mine. Hahahah.
~AdventureAng
Happy flying to everybody. Now get off the computer and get a kite out! hehe

#11 Watty

Watty

    Forum Veteran

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,867 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Vancouver, WA

Posted 15 August 2007 - 07:41 AM

Gotcha. I thought for sure he would make a thread about it if he got one. Anyway, I hate to jack threads so Darryl, to sum things up here, go for a vented B-Series, and get a Std. one eventually.

Spence "Watty" Watson

Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image

 


#12 lasapcheong

lasapcheong

    Occasional Poster

  • Forum Member
  • PipPip
  • 98 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Singapore

Posted 15 August 2007 - 09:34 AM

Thanks for all the replies. I guess I'll be getting a standard after all...as I've mentioned the reality of the wind situation is that high winds are not as common compared to droughts of very low wind..

If I can afford it I'll like to go for a standard and a vented as well too! But oh well..

Darryl

#13 Fraser

Fraser

    Regular Poster

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 389 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Staffordshire, UK

Posted 15 August 2007 - 10:14 AM

Hi All,

I've been reading this thread with interest, being lucky enough to have a vented and an un-vented B-Series which allows me to choose depending on the wind.

Now, I'm definitely a learner at all this and I'm sure that it has a great deal deal to do with my lack of skill, but I really struggle with the vented if there isn't a good stiff breeze blowing. Even with a full two-wrap frame in, it's still difficult to keep the vented up in less than a proper breeze.

The bummer is, when I then switch to the standard, non-vented kite, I find that at this low level of skill, it's difficult to be smooth or accurate and I generally just whiz the thing about, rather than being able to hover and turn precisely. All still great fun of course, but ultimately pretty frustrating.

Hopefully, all this will diminish as I get better, but we'll see I guess! Anyone got any thoughts? Is this just a stage we all go through?

Had two or three really good days over the past three weeks - proper wind, reasonably steady - and it's amazing how it's possible to make real progress when the wind's on your side! I'm still a long, long way from 'owning my hover', but I did at least put a down-payment on it! Even if I did manage to lose a spar (luckily a three-wrap, of which I have plenty with having two B-Series, but still enraging!) in some long grass...! :kid_brooding: Looked and looked and looked, but finally had to accept that some little brat would find it and use it as a sword for a few minutes before throwing it away again. Grrr!

#14 wufer

wufer

    Regular Poster

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 319 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:yorkshire uk

Posted 15 August 2007 - 11:02 AM

Fraser.
Next time you fly your standerd, before you start, tie your bottom lines on the next knot in from the knot you use now on your handles(ie if you useualy fly with your bottom lines tied to the last knot on the handles. try the next knot in).
This will give you more brake and will slow things down a bit.
Try it and see.
I understand iquad use as much brake as thy can ,so if its good enough for JB, its good enough for us mortals.
Or am i wrong JB


Derek

#15 AdventureAng

AdventureAng

    Regular Poster

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 473 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:New Jersey

Posted 15 August 2007 - 11:07 AM

Hi All,

I've been reading this thread with interest, being lucky enough to have a vented and an un-vented B-Series which allows me to choose depending on the wind.

Now, I'm definitely a learner at all this and I'm sure that it has a great deal deal to do with my lack of skill, but I really struggle with the vented if there isn't a good stiff breeze blowing. Even with a full two-wrap frame in, it's still difficult to keep the vented up in less than a proper breeze.

The bummer is, when I then switch to the standard, non-vented kite, I find that at this low level of skill, it's difficult to be smooth or accurate and I generally just whiz the thing about, rather than being able to hover and turn precisely. All still great fun of course, but ultimately pretty frustrating.

Hopefully, all this will diminish as I get better, but we'll see I guess! Anyone got any thoughts? Is this just a stage we all go through?

Had two or three really good days over the past three weeks - proper wind, reasonably steady - and it's amazing how it's possible to make real progress when the wind's on your side! I'm still a long, long way from 'owning my hover', but I did at least put a down-payment on it! Even if I did manage to lose a spar (luckily a three-wrap, of which I have plenty with having two B-Series, but still enraging!) in some long grass...! :kid_brooding: Looked and looked and looked, but finally had to accept that some little brat would find it and use it as a sword for a few minutes before throwing it away again. Grrr!


Flying the vented in low winds is definitaly a skill that takes a while to build up. Heck, even flying a non-vented one in low winds still has me puzzeled at times. I remember at the Wildwood Fest at some point the winds dropped down and I was frustrated with my non-vented B-series because I couldn't make it fly, and then I look over to iQuad and they were flying on venteds. What's up with that!? SO it goes to show, that with a little skill and practice, you can fly in any winds, if not any wind at all, so just keep at it and light wind problems will be a thing of the past. You definitally get a workout (i.e. from running backwards), when trying to fly a vented in lower than normal winds than you're used to, but it's all practice right?
~AdventureAng
Happy flying to everybody. Now get off the computer and get a kite out! hehe

#16 wufer

wufer

    Regular Poster

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 319 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:yorkshire uk

Posted 15 August 2007 - 11:10 AM

Darryl, sorry, we bad.
Back to topic.

#17 Kitelife

Kitelife

    Forum Guru

  • Forum Host
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,934 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Portland, OR USA

Posted 15 August 2007 - 11:55 AM

With the "official" B-Series handles, assuming all your four lines are of even length, try setting the top lines to 3rd adjustment knot from the end.

That is my recommend setting for all B-Series in their ideal winds.

With the vented ONLY, you might pull the top line in to the 4th knot in lighter winds.

With either kite, in extreme high winds, try going to the 2nd knot (more brake).

Tuning is EVERYTHING.

Also, for lighter winds, if you haven't already, take a look at this article...

http://www.kitelife....ind40/index.htm

Let us know what you find, using all of that information. ;)

John Barresi

johnbarresi.com | kitelife.com | learnkites.com | teamiquad.comkitemap.org
youtube.com/kitelife | facebook.com/kitelifemagazine | KiteLife on Google+

 

President - American Kitefliers Association

"We cannot direct the wind, but we can adjust the sails."
(found in a fortune cookie - possibly an Einstein quote)

My full list of kite articles - kitelife.com/author/john-barresi
 

Please reward posts that are helpful, give positive reputation by clicking on "Like This" button on the right side of each post.


#18 awindofchange

awindofchange

    Frequent Poster

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 875 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Las Vegas, Nevada

Posted 15 August 2007 - 01:28 PM

Saying you can fly in 25+ mph winds or 2-3 mph winds with a standard weighted kite is one thing...but how much fun are you having? :kid_cussing:

I have found that the standard 1.5 or B-series works awesome from winds of 5-6 mph up to about 14-15 mph. In the stronger/lighter winds we adjust our handles to compensate for the increase/decrease in pull. 15mph and up the kite can start to be a handful to fly. The more experience you have the easier it will be to fly in the stronger winds but the fun factor really starts to drop quite a bit. I have flown a standard 1.5 in winds around the 25 mph range but it wasn't that much fun and I was worried all the time about blowing out the sail or exploding the frame. Wasn't really that much fun although it was "possible".

If the winds are consistently 12mph and up then the Vented comes out of the bag and all is totally wonderful. The Vented kite can handle up to 20+ mph winds like it is nothing, it eats up gusty conditions like they are nothing. Again over 30 and the Vented starts to be a handful and things start to get a little crazy. After pulling the Vented out and if the wind does drop down to the 10 mph or less I still continue to fly and it is possible to get down to the 7-8 mph range but I am seriously thinking of parking it and setting up the standard. Again the fun factor dies under 10mph with the Vented although it is still possible to do.

For the light winds it is about the same. For a beginner anything under 5 mph is going to be a true challenge. You can put the 2 wrap in and lighten the kite up a lot and it will fly but still very delicately and there is a lot of skill needed to keep the kite flying. With good technique and a lot of practice, flying in 2ish mph winds will be possible but the fun factor is pretty low compared to that sweet 7-10 mph constant wind.

My suggesting if your winds are mostly between the 5 and 15 mph is the standard B-series. I think that this kite will give you the most air time and the funnest flying in those winds. The B-series has the most versatility of all the Rev's with the two frames and you can mix-n-match the frames to get that ultimate setup for your current wind conditions. The Vented kite is totally awesome and can make gusty or strong wind conditions feel smooth and wonderful...which is why so many people love that kite. But with your conditions I still think the Standard B would be your best choice. Later down the road you can add the Vented and you will have the best of all worlds.

Just my two cents....hope that helps.

#19 Kitelife

Kitelife

    Forum Guru

  • Forum Host
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,934 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Portland, OR USA

Posted 15 August 2007 - 01:31 PM

Well said Kent, as always. ;)

John Barresi

johnbarresi.com | kitelife.com | learnkites.com | teamiquad.comkitemap.org
youtube.com/kitelife | facebook.com/kitelifemagazine | KiteLife on Google+

 

President - American Kitefliers Association

"We cannot direct the wind, but we can adjust the sails."
(found in a fortune cookie - possibly an Einstein quote)

My full list of kite articles - kitelife.com/author/john-barresi
 

Please reward posts that are helpful, give positive reputation by clicking on "Like This" button on the right side of each post.


#20 FortFlyer

FortFlyer

    Jimi Quadsticks

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,405 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Bedford Ma. USA

Posted 15 August 2007 - 01:35 PM

I would like to offer 2 forms of advice that may help you in the dreaded low wind (or any wind)

1: Set the bottom lines as close to the handles as you can then forget they exist, that leaves all your adjusting to the top lines only, need more lift bring the line back a knot or more, need more brake let it out 1 or more knots (keep adjusting simple) and it becomes less frustrating.

2: this will help out the adjustments, there is no need to hold the handles like your riding a motorcycle, the grips are there for reference you don't need to hold them with clenched fists, this is the one problem I've seen ALL new fliers do.

For low wind I let the handles just pretty much hang on my hands so that my for finger is between the top of the foam and the top of the handle, thumbs above the foam on the back side and the rest of my fingers just laying on the foam with the bottoms just free dangling.

Once your lines are set (you'll almost default to them once you find "YOUR" happy place) tapping your fingers on the foam is all you need to turn, I have a bad habit which I hope no one picks up I hold my handles so relaxed and still have full control that I've often tossed them with arm movements (not often but the zone does strange things to you)

So in a nut shell adjust 2 lines instead of 4 and loosen up that grip a bit and see how that goes.

Good Luck, Hope that helps :kid_smartass:


damn 2 posts in the time it took me to type this out lol
Jim,
Ft. Taber Park & Brenton Point

Rev's are like a carbon framed out-of-body experience

Posted Image




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users