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keeping sand out of endcaps


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#21 Kitelife

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Posted 07 December 2009 - 01:17 PM

Been years since I've run into a Rev end cap I couldn't get off using a "peanut butter jar" kind of grip. :)

John Barresi

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#22 Jim Foster

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Posted 07 December 2009 - 01:33 PM

Peanut Butter...

That could be the answer. How about just dipping the end of the spar in peanut butter before it is inserted into the end cap.

That should seal the cap against the spar to keep the sand out, and when you are finished flying you would have a snack to hold you over until you get to the pizza and beer. :huh:

Edited by Jim Foster, 07 December 2009 - 01:34 PM.

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#23 Kitelife

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Posted 07 December 2009 - 07:30 PM

Smooth, of course. :)

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#24 Jim Foster

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Posted 07 December 2009 - 10:05 PM

Smooth, of course. :)


You betcha

Smooth as a vented Rev.
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#25 Jeepster

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Posted 08 December 2009 - 05:39 AM

You betcha

Smooth as a vented Rev.


Speaking of vented ... as Stephen Hoath once said, on this topic I think you're "all venting and no sail."

Cheers,
Tom

#26 Wayne

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Posted 08 December 2009 - 07:47 AM

Hello, I'm just curious as to why not put the dust cover type end caps, like come on the top, for the vertical spars. Why not use these on the bottom and on the end of the leading edge ?
nick


Nick,

One factor is weight. The silicone tubing I use (4 pieces of 1/2" length) weighs 3 grams. I found when flying with light wind and not at the 1 site where the sand texture causes a problem, removing them helped me handle the lulls. If you use the covers that Rev uses, the weight might be higher and they will not be as easily removable when not needed. I only have trouble with sand getting between 2-wrap and race rods and the end caps at one beach (Belmar in New Jersey). Larger diameter rods and beaches with finer sand do not produce the problem I encountered. I used the silicone tubing the last 2 sessions at Belmar where the weight was not an issue (strong winds, vented kites).

Since I equipped my Race and 2-wrap rods with 1" pieces of heat shrink tubing, I leave them on all the time as they only add 1 gram total and help close the gap with these thinner rods. I have them extended over the end of the rod by 1/16 - 1/8" so they shrink down over the end forming a smooth end for inserting.

In general, the silicone tubing is probably a better choice for most who are concerned about this, since it is easily added or removed when needed. YMMV

Wayne Reed
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#27 Reef Runner

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 04:32 PM

Nick,

One factor is weight. The silicone tubing I use (4 pieces of 1/2" length) weighs 3 grams. I found when flying with light wind and not at the 1 site where the sand texture causes a problem, removing them helped me handle the lulls. If you use the covers that Rev uses, the weight might be higher and they will not be as easily removable when not needed. I only have trouble with sand getting between 2-wrap and race rods and the end caps at one beach (Belmar in New Jersey). Larger diameter rods and beaches with finer sand do not produce the problem I encountered. I used the silicone tubing the last 2 sessions at Belmar where the weight was not an issue (strong winds, vented kites).

Since I equipped my Race and 2-wrap rods with 1" pieces of heat shrink tubing, I leave them on all the time as they only add 1 gram total and help close the gap with these thinner rods. I have them extended over the end of the rod by 1/16 - 1/8" so they shrink down over the end forming a smooth end for inserting.

In general, the silicone tubing is probably a better choice for most who are concerned about this, since it is easily added or removed when needed. YMMV


Hey Wayne,
I understand what you are saying. I was mainly thinking about when flying in higher wind conditions, with a vented kite, anyway, so I was thinking that maybe the extra weight wouldn't matter. I don't know how much the little weights, that come with the B-series kites weigh (2 grams, I think), but I was hoping that maybe without the weights, the dust cap end caps (like on the topside), would maybe equal out.

Anyway, let me get this straight. You are saying that using shrink tubing on a race rod and on a 2-wrap, will still go into the end caps, and basically, this fills the gap enough, that the sand can't enter ? I kind of like that, from a protection standpoint also, you know, splintering the ends or the rods etc.

But as for the silicone tubing idea, I was thinking of just using short 1/4" lengths, and simply putting them on the rod ends, that will go into an end cap, but placing them just close enough to the ends, so that when the end cap goes on, the bungee would apply just enough pressure, forcing the end cap against the piece of tubing, to seal off the opening. I don't know if that will be sufficient or not. I suppose it will depend on how tight the bungee pulls the end cap against the end of the piece of tubing. (I hope I explained that clearly)

Either way, the method described earlier, that actually covers both, part of the end cap, as well as part of the tube, would probably be the best. It just seems that it would be a real pain, when assembling and disassemblying.

I fly on the sand dunes, on the NC Outer Banks (Jockey's Ridge), and I have the sand problem, every time I fly, so I've got to try something, next time I'm out there................. thanks for your help......reef runner

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#28 Jeepster

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Posted 22 June 2010 - 05:15 AM

... I even got rid of the factory dust covers, up top, and replaced them with a piece of silicone tubing, at the top of the vertical spars. ...

Look carefully under the Dacron at the top of the vertical rod (between the leading edge tube and the reinforcement piece), you'll find a small Kevlar patch that helps prevent wear-through from the vertical rods rubbing against the leading edge rods. The "dust covers" are there to provide additional cushioning at that intersection. No problem removing them, but the fabric will have a tendency to wear through faster.

While we're talking about that intersection. If you never rotate your non-ferruled rods, check the two wing rods and see if you can't notice some rubbing where the two rods cross.

Cheers,
Tom

#29 Reef Runner

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Posted 22 June 2010 - 05:25 AM

OK, tested and approved, with flying colors. I put the 1/4" pieces silicon tubing, on the ends of all the spars, just short, of where the end caps would go. Then when I assembled the kite, I used the end caps to force the pieces just a bit further, to the correct spot. The silicone tubing held it's position, without fail, and the bungees held the end caps, pressed tightly against the piece of tubing. I am happy to say, I did not get one grain of sand, in any joint. I flew numerous times daily, for an entire week, without any problems. On the verticals, once one end cap was removed, the other end would actually fall off - NO Sticking. Previous flights had actually required pliers to remove the end caps, as the sand is so fine, that it gets into every little gap or opening. I had wham, wham, whammed, till I was afraid that I would break the spars or end caps, and they still wouldn't budge. Now, with this very simple improvisation, I have had no problems at all (not one grain of sand). And as for the upper verticals {thanks for the reminder, Jeepster}, on second thought, probably shouldn't remove those factory dust covers, due to wear and tear that may likely occur, between the leading edge spar and sleeve, and the vertical spar end cap, itself. Just slide a piece of surgical tubing up against the factory, rubber dust cover, just as you do on the other end caps. I couldn't be more pleased with the results, as sand is my main flight deck, and I don't' have a problem, disassembling, any more....................
(I used silicon tubing with a 3/8" OD x 3/16" ID, cut into 1/4" lengths)
(see illustration in attached file - may not be drawn to scale)

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#30 Reef Runner

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Posted 22 June 2010 - 05:28 AM

Look carefully under the Dacron at the top of the vertical rod (between the leading edge tube and the reinforcement piece), you'll find a small Kevlar patch that helps prevent wear-through from the vertical rods rubbing against the leading edge rods. The "dust covers" are there to provide additional cushioning at that intersection. No problem removing them, but the fabric will have a tendency to wear through faster.

While we're talking about that intersection. If you never rotate your non-ferruled rods, check the two wing rods and see if you can't notice some rubbing where the two rods cross.

Cheers,
Tom


Absolutely, but I thought that was due to sand, inside of the leading edge tube, but it is definately noticable...........

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#31 stroke survivor

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 01:56 PM

I'm going to try another approach - I am going to use O rings instead of silicone tubing! They fit tightly on the rods and I will place them short of an ending position so the caps move them into a finished position! Gonna try this out the day I go to Long Beach next week, will give an update on how this works out!! :)

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#32 stroke survivor

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 09:36 AM

Went up to Long Beach and tested out the "o" ring fix - A-OK!!! Changed frames once and disassembled kite after a long day, and not one bit of trouble!! Haven't weighed them, but 4 small rings - 2 on the LE and 2 at the bottom of the verts, can't be much!!! Got mine at an auto parts store, I'm sure any hardware store has 'em too!!!! :kid_smartass: Did just like Reef Runner too, put 'em on short of finished position and let the caps push them into place!!! :)

Edited by stroke victim, 20 August 2010 - 09:38 AM.

wayne from portland
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#33 Reef Runner

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 04:36 PM

Went up to Long Beach and tested out the "o" ring fix - A-OK!!! Changed frames once and disassembled kite after a long day, and not one bit of trouble!! Haven't weighed them, but 4 small rings - 2 on the LE and 2 at the bottom of the verts, can't be much!!! Got mine at an auto parts store, I'm sure any hardware store has 'em too!!!! Posted Image Did just like Reef Runner too, put 'em on short of finished position and let the caps push them into place!!! Posted Image


Sounds like you got it going on.......... Now wasn't that nice, not to have to deal with, welded on, end caps...................Posted Image I might just try your method some day, but right now, my surgical tubing is doing just great, and I've got a bunch of it. Posted Image I'll never fly on sand again, without something on the spars. I've got all of my revs outfitted, now............Glad you had success................Posted Image

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#34 stroke survivor

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 09:05 PM

Sounds like you got it going on.......... Now wasn't that nice, not to have to deal with, welded on, end caps...................Posted Image I might just try your method some day, but right now, my surgical tubing is doing just great, and I've got a bunch of it. Posted Image I'll never fly on sand again, without something on the spars. I've got all of my revs outfitted, now............Glad you had success................:kid_smartass:


Thanks for keeping track!!! The nice thing is that the "o" rings are easy to move rod set to rod set!!! :kid_smartass: Only need a couple of extras in case you lose one!!!! :) Made so much difference!! Thanks for getting the old thinking cap a-working!!!! :lol:

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#35 stroke survivor

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Posted 13 October 2010 - 09:00 AM

Update on this!!! The "o" rings work really well, but take a 3 wrap and a race rod with you!! :blink: I've found that you will need smaller (tighter) rings on your 2 wrap and race rods!!! :) The rings that fit a 3 or 4 wrap work OK, but a tighter fit would work better on the smaller (thinner) rods!!!:) Either way, dis-assembly has become soooo much easier!!!! :kid_smartass: Plus they add almost no extra weight!!!! :kid_content:

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#36 dazlarsen

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Posted 17 October 2010 - 10:51 AM

Ben using the O ring method for a while now,and have no problems
With spar removal.I have also put the O ring's
Inside the end caps as a sort of shock absorber to
Protect the ends of the spares when landing on
Hard objects.
All the best

Daz

#37 kwmf

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 05:44 AM

+1 on the O-ring method here ... just got back from a lunch time test flight Posted Image

I made sure to drop the ends into the sand, launch hard and slide them on the deck .... works very well.

#38 stroke survivor

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 10:40 AM

Nice to be able to take your kite apart easily, eh!!!:kid_content:

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#39 kwmf

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 11:29 PM

That too ... I just like to keep my gear in top shape, and the grinding going on inside that endcap is definitely something I don't like. I could always get the endcap off, but sometimes it took a bit and it always took a little grinding.


KiteCowboy rekons I'm allergic to sand, I say I look after my gear - With the Dollar exchange rate I can't afford to treat my kites as consumables.

#40 Reef Runner

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 05:06 AM

Sounds like you guys have really got it going on, with those O-rings. I've still got several yards of silicon, or surgical tubing, and a baggie full of 1/4 inch pieces, already cut and ready for use. I also keep a spare end cap in the baggie, just to use for the installation process. All of my frames are now equipped with 1/4" pieces of the tubing, even my spare rods and extra rod sets. That stuff seems to stay put and in place, quite well. Once you take that end cap, and force the piece of tubing into it's proper place on the spar, so that you've got a nice even seal, between it and the end cap, it stays there, and doesn't move around on you. And YES, it is great to be able to take your kites apart easily, and not worry that you are going to break something, just trying to disassemble the frame.

Don't take me wrong, I'm not knocking the O-ring solution at all. Everyone has to do what they feel is best, or easiest, for their own particular situation. In my situation, I already had some silicon tubing, which got me to thinking. And being the correct size, I was able to equip all of my rods, from 4-wraps down to race rods, with the same tubing. I found out, after a few test runs, that I could leave these pieces on the rods, without fear of slippage, which surely beats trying to move them from one kite to another, and besides, I only have one size spare part, to keep up with, in my bag. I will admit, the O-ring is probably a bit easier to install, initially, but I'll just continue to take a bit more time, and use the tubing. After all, what else am I going to do with all of these little pieces, in my flight bag? My main point is, that once they are on, they are on "to stay".

I've got two brand new revs, that I equipped with the tubing, before they were ever saw the sky. Those spars look just like they did, the day they left the Rev factory. All my other, BST spars (that's Before Silicon Tubing) appear scarred and scratched on the ends (the part that goes into the end caps), and that is from nothing but SAND. At least at this point, I've got that wear and tear, halted, and it shouldn't progress, any farther. As "KWMF" stated, I likewise, can not allow my kites to become consumables. They've got to last me a while, and barring a severe crash, or some other mishap, my spars are going to last a long, long time, and remain in good condition. I just wish I could think of something to protect those inside joints, in the leading edge. Either way, I suppose that I'll stick with my old surgical tubing method, or maybe it'll be stuck on me, or my spars, anyway! Posted Image

ps............If interested, I use silicon tubing with a 3/8" OD x 3/16" ID, cut off square, into 1/4" lengths

If you happen to be interested, take a look at the attachment below. I think I posted it somewhere in an earlier post ! If so, I apologize....

Attached Files


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