53 replies to this topic

[Sailor99]

I tried out a French Bridle (not the turbo diagram from Hector) on one of Ben's kites. I liked it so much I'm converting several more kites over. Geeze it uses a ton of line!

In what way did you find it better? Was it more suited to any particular style of flying?

[REVflyer]

I am trying to get a bit more precise in my flying, thought this might be nice crutch for a hacker like me.
(Why practice?,... when I can change something instead!)

The new bridle didn't really allow me to do anything startling or brand new,
but it did have a nicer "grab of air", since the attachment points are actually outside of the down spars.

With a very light weight leading edge tube(s), indoor, Race or Pro. it seemed to cup more of the wind than the standard bridle. Leading edge looks like a big horseshoe in flight, when standing underneath the kite. Once in motion it didn't feel that different at all, but that 1st yank-back on the handles certainly was a weird sensation!

Since there are so many attachment points between the bridle and the frame, it's impossible to snag a flying line. Everything seems to shed a tangle pretty effortlessly. I do run the training wheels on the back of my sails though, as I like that extra stiffness in the sail/frame connections.

Geeze, that french bridle does have a lot of darn places where two legs needed to attach together during assembly. I'm still laying out a bridle board trying to determine the proper sequence of assembly and to simplify the overall process enough to present a modification clinic for the MKS Retreat over president's day weekend this February.

[chewbaka]

hi folks, its me, chewy from germany.
please excuse my horrible english.

i just want to show you another version of "the french" bridle",
i put on my "tiger"

have a look here: TIGER
you´ll find the measures in centimetres on the bottom of the page.

i have to say, that this version of the bridle "might be good for one, but even not fpr others". if you are interested, just give it a try. if you add a a pre-tied adjustment knot system (like we use on our handles), to every fixing-point of the bridle,
you can change the flight behaviour within seconds.
try out to change the distance of the left and right part of the bridle.

maybe some of you will have fun with it!

regs chewie

[Kitelife]

Thanks for posting Chewie, welcome to the Rev forum.

[beach]

Hello all, I have several different version of the bridle on kites and for me nothing seems to work as well as
the original and thats an honest view...... Sure you can gain some ability with some changes but what I end
up losing makes it a wash for me, one of the biggest things with all the bridles i've tested was the fact that I
lose my ability to floats way off in the corner of the widow..... One of my favorite things is to take the kite as
far as it will go in the corner then walk it in even further and get 3 of the 4 lines totally slack, this happens when
my body gets in front of the kite and I just have fun with that for some reason........ Once again this is just me
but I have seen most everything thats done with a modified bridle done with the stock bridle, don't anybody
get upset cause what I talk about as far as flying is what works for me no more no less........
Me, Me, Me, Me, this is what works for me, but I always tell people to try new things and figure out what works
for you.........Ben


Welcome to the forum and keep on showing us new things...........

[Choccy]

i put on my "tiger"

Hallo chewie

rather striking tiger in the snow, brrrrrrrrrrr, he's grrrrrrrrrrrrreat
thank you posting your photos.

[REVflyer]

Crazy Drivers' French Bridle is commercially available from Flying Smiles kites (fabricated with permission of the french team by Will Sturdy) for the 1point5 platform right now. Been using this for almost two years now, most of my kites are slowly being converted.

I have one on my Zen that's still in testing stages. It is everything I'd ever hoped for and now that I have a lot of time on it I complain loudly when I'm flying someone else's wing without one.

On the Zen it allows the kite to fly comfortably in winds that you'd match up with a mid-vent. Of course you keep all the low wind performance! I marry it up with the magic sticks on the back also.

The best fifty bucks you'll ever spend on a set of kite modifications!

[SkyPuppet]

Crazy Drivers' French Bridle is commercially available from Flying Smiles kites (fabricated with permission of the french team by Will Sturdy) for the 1point5 platform right now. Been using this for almost two years now, most of my kites are slowly being converted.

I have one on my Zen that's still in testing stages. It is everything I'd ever hoped for and now that I have a lot of time on it I complain loudly when I'm flying someone else's wing without one.

On the Zen it allows the kite to fly comfortably in winds that you'd match up with a mid-vent. Of course you keep all the low wind performance! I marry it up with the magic sticks on the back also.

The best fifty bucks you'll ever spend on a set of kite modifications!

REVflyer, are you pairing this setup with the stock Zen frame?

[REVflyer]

Yes., all stock Zen tubes all around. The magic sticks are 19-1/8 inches long (125 carbon tubes). Yesterday I was out in winds from zero to 10 mph, mostly 2 to 7 range. Flying the zen on 90 feet of 90# LPG using 15 inch no-snag handles. I can't throw it that far, but with the sticks on the back that doesn't matter. It goes out as far as it goes and lands ready for inverted launch ever time. The catch is pretty reliable on this length but I've practiced plenty on 120s and the up-wind glide is like nothing you have ever witnessed. The slow precision aspect of flying this rig is simply incredible. It has a weighted presence on the end of the lines but effortlessly powers-up when you are inclined to do so regardless of the wind conditions. Dumping the air-pressure requires big dramatic movements if it's blowing, but I like to fly with this flailing style. Axels are so slow you can choke 'em back halfway and the kite will not fall forward. Ground work and target landing (like a squared-off fence post) are great practice. I'm still a little careful around kids though because the thing is so darn big.

My feeling is Revolution secretly consulted me in developing this kite. It seems it was perfectly made for my style and my local conditions. Lately it's the first kite out of the bag and last one I want to put down. I've worn out the bridle it came with, converted to the french bridle and slapped some sticks on the back of the frame from another Rev 1 kite. The sticks didn't even fit correctly, leaning in from the outside edge, instead of being 90 degrees square. The panel layouts and overall shape are different between the two kites, but I'm too lazy to make it right on the Zen.

Uncle benny advised me to move the top part of the bridle back one half of an inch, but honestly I think the darn thing is pretty sweet right now. Like I said, when these are commercially available it will be the best two $25 packets ever spent on kite modifications. Durable and a big wind range, all targeted at the low end. Want a gust buster for long lines? I'm thinkin' all that mass will channel thru the wake and swirls. A couple of power-ups and it's at the top of the wind window again. I love to just release the handles and watch it gracefully float away unencumbered by pilot interference. That freedom downwind glide is at least 3 times the released altitude in distance. I will wager no other kite can match this performance without the sticks. The french bridle is nice but less of a prerequisite and will require some time to become comfortable with it. (hours) There's no wiggle or slack bridle movement, you can yank & spank or fly all smooth & graceful in a dead calm or swirly gust. I'm loving both sides of the performance offered by this kite and enjoying the time I put into the Zen.

[SkyPuppet]

Thanks for the performance description!

The stock Zen frame is a little bendy for my flying style. It sounds like the sticks and french bridle combination might help me.
I'm glad to hear that you are performing catch-n-throws (on 90' lines!) on the stock Zen frame. I did a catch on 30' lines with my Zen, and it bowtied so bad I thought for sure it was going to break. Maybe the sticks help in this situation too.

I love my Zen, the more time I spend with it, the more I enjoy it and its graceful flight. But, due to my flying style, soon I will need to do something about the stock frame to further my enjoyment - either replace it with a different frame or add something like the magic sticks to it.

[stroke survivor]

Adding the "magic sticks" and their lines forms a sort of truss system that stiffens up the frame and prevents any bow tying by the sail!! Nice thing is, if you don't like it, it's easy to remove!! If you do, hey, you found something that works!!

[SkyPuppet]

Adding the "magic sticks" and their lines forms a sort of truss system that stiffens up the frame and prevents any bow tying by the sail!! Nice thing is, if you don't like it, it's easy to remove!! If you do, hey, you found something that works!!

Good point SV!

There's still a debate going on in my head though. Adding the 'sticks and its lines, and the mass that comes with them, to my ultimate SUL Zen just flat out defies logic..... But I'm going to give it a try! Once they are commercially available
Same for the French bridle.

[REVflyer]

Cath & Elliott of flying smiles kites . . . .... . will be awaiting your phone call and visa information (soon).

I'm meeting Paul Dugard at Sandy Point State Park tomorrow for some airtime. I'm sure we'll abuse our zens, maybe even a side-by-side comparison, his box stock (w/Sissy sticks) against my all modified all over. We've got all the same line-lengths, #strengths and handle rigs. I certainly respect his opinion too. If all goes well I'll confirm with Will Sturdy the bridle's dimensions, what's on my Zen right now it already converted into a bridle board (gotta' love a youngster's enthusiasm!) So unless we "fiddle" with it some more it's going commercial.

I know how weird it sounds to add weight when you're working with an SUL or even an indoor kite. It's about WHERE you place it as much as WHY. I want the ability to remove as much weight as possible, but sometimes adding MORE is less work in flight. Mass + momentum make free lift, so if you yank a moment you can travel for some distance before another input is necessary. I have a very particular way of doing things and I'm used to it. Some pilots love how my kite flies (tuning & mods) and some quickly pronounce it "in no way flight worthy at all"!

If I change kites for different conditions I want them to be like golf clubs, everything is the same except the wind range target that one's made for. My indoor kite has to fly exactly the same (in feelings down the lines) as my ultra-high winder. So my indoor kite has a bridle and sissy sticks on the back. The handles are smaller, shorter, much lighter in weight and the lines are shorter, but the feeling transmitted is still the same. That killer glide remains too, which is something I've grown accustomed to over the years. So, if you release the kite handles with the leading edge pointed away, the kite glides off with the handles suspended underneath of it. It doesn't fall. You can watch it for a few moments and then trot down towards it and not allow it to impact the floor, either catching the kite or re-gripping the handles. You can go to the bathroom and return again, it's still not landed! If I have to keep all this crap on the kite then the weight saving necessary for indoor flight has to come from someplace else! You'd use Orcon instead of icarex and 125 carbon tubes with a P-90 leading edge instead of a "suitable frame". Since the frame is so flexible every flight command distorts it, so the bridle has to be really long (built further away from the frame). At the end of the day though, everything flies the same, regardless of the conditions because the same design features are incorporated into each kite. It just feels right in my hands (and maybe no one else's!?!!)

You have to be willing to experiment, don't trust anyone's opinion except your own, you try it and prove to yourself it didn't work. Most modifications end in failure, the journey is the most important part. You learn and establish your own expectations based upon that knowledge gained and shared. I didn't come up with any of this stuff I use currently, sticks, funky bridles, switching manufacturer's tubes or hybrid frames. Harold Ames hung rare magnets on our cooperative kites back in 1999. That weight increase didn't hurt performance because we placed it very carefully.

What happens is a wonderful question, you can always put it back to stock. Ideally you have somebody to share and compare with, that makes everything much easier and more enjoyable.

Add curvature to the downspars using the sissy sticks (means they're installed too tightly),... what happens? Cut down those down-spars by an inch,... What happens? (can't undue this one <LOL!> You get the idea, experiment, this platform is made to enjoy, fiddling with stuff is almost as much fun as flying. You'll develop your own expectations in feel and run with it.

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[SkyPuppet]

<snip> You can go to the bathroom and return again, it's still not landed! <snip>

Man, its a GOOD thing to laugh really hard first thing in the morning!!

I'm excited to work on some mods, down the road. I think I should totally settle on a particular way my Revs "feel" before I get into custom modding. I would love to have all my kites have that same "feel", and it really does seem like it would take some modification to get the full-vent feeling like the Zen feeling like the full-sail. In the meantime though, I am willing to try commercially available mods so long as I can easily return my kite to stock.

I'm very thankful for your pioneering spirit REVflyer! And for the way you report back on your mods - in some circles, people seem to like to keep their performance mods secretive (especially the R/C crowd!).