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#1 Felix Mottram

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 12:15 PM

Hi Bart,

You are probably correct.

There is the beginning in this thread of what may turn out to be a number of ideas that just happened to be sparked by the good natured fun approach to what happened in 2010.

A key flier was missing at Portsmouth 2008 as I recall. 47 were flying rather than 48... or something like that! The subsequent comment was about the 2010 Long Beach performance.

Getting 100 fliers set-up to fly is certainly an interesting project.

Getting smaller groups say 12 or 16 plus up to speed is also an exciting project in its own right quite apart from a building block to the very large team scenario.

The challenge of getting 100 plus international fliers together at one venue is the big one! I do not think that an individual 'event' is likely to get the resources to realise this ambition so a different approach may be required.

I hope that this forum can be fixed and that it continues to be the place for focused discussion of these projects.

Maybe I should post this message as a new topic. [EDIT So here it is]

Thanks

Felix

#2 stroke survivor

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:08 AM

Thanks Felix - that feels better! After all, it is a new and ambitious project on it's own!! While I didn't fly in the last record, I'm coming and participating in this one!! Posted Image

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wayne from portland
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#3 Felix Mottram

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 11:38 AM

Thanks Felix - that feels better! After all, it is a new and ambitious project on it's own!! While I didn't fly in the last record, I'm coming and participating in this one!! Posted Image

SAVE MY PLACE IN LINE!!Posted Image


Hi Wayne,

Glad to hear that you are on board for Long Beach 2013.

If travel costs were not so high it would be easy to do the hundred with fliers from Europe and Japan. I have not yet booked my flight yet but when I last looked the price was somewhat painful...

I think that focusing on the Super 16 is an equally valid project and could achieve some great results very quickly.

We are going to fly nine this coming weekend as a starting point but hope to involve other fliers on the day. This will be with only 3 'Decs'! We flew 12 the other week and developed a new move 'just like that'! <grins>

Felix

#4 bartman

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 01:07 PM

I would be kinda cool to set up as many teams of 16 as possible the week of WSIKF and fly those as teams as much as possible (everyone has a team and sticks with that team so not musical chairs or as few musical chairs as needed there will always be people coming and going throughout the week). Each being their own "Super 16" and doing whatever the skill level of the group can do throughout the week. Come together for the big 100 push as required.

Bart

#5 Felix Mottram

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 02:29 PM

I would be kinda cool to set up as many teams of 16 as possible the week of WSIKF and fly those as teams as much as possible (everyone has a team and sticks with that team so not musical chairs or as few musical chairs as needed there will always be people coming and going throughout the week). Each being their own "Super 16" and doing whatever the skill level of the group can do throughout the week. Come together for the big 100 push as required.

Bart


Hi Bart,

My thinking also but if there are close to 100 then teams of 25 would be good. Bringing 4 teams of 25 together would be very neat...

Felix

#6 stroke survivor

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:18 PM

Felix - I'm getting your logic on that!! 25 divides evenly into 100 and each group could form a quadrant! Posted Image

Bart - getting people to stay in their groups would be nice, at least for the record attempts!! You know how folks move about day by day or even hour by hour!!Posted Image

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#7 bartman

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 06:23 AM

Yes people move around and not everyone is there all week so there will always be floaters in every group of 25. That fact will never change, but generally the more people that can stay on a specific "super team" the whole time the better I think. I think this for a couple of reasons. One, everyone will get familiar with the flyers in their group as to strengths and weaknesses so as a group a good spot can be figured out for each flyer and two, the grid building practice can be lead by four different super team leaders throughout the week at various times and places instead of random throw it up sort of things on the main Rev field here and there. Not to say the Rev field should not be used for practice runs, but there is lots of room to take a quad off to another spot for some practice so two or three quads could be up at once working out the kinks out of each others way.

I think next year there could be some really cool stuff happening in the air because the majority of the people involved will have been in some form of large grid in the last two years so the concept is not new and the nerves are more at ease which opens the mind to take on something bigger both in number of kites and what "show" will be seen in the air. Doesn't all have to be threads and ball bursts.

Bart

#8 stroke survivor

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 08:21 AM

Bart - that's definitely an advantage - flying together!! Getting to know strengths and weaknesses really helps when you're gonna tackle something this grand!! The better you know the group you're in, easier it is to anticipate things!! But like you also said - there are always "floaters" or irregular arrivals, having a basic grouping or core will make it easier to adapt to "new" fliers!!

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#9 Felix Mottram

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:19 AM

Bart - that's definitely an advantage - flying together!! Getting to know strengths and weaknesses really helps when you're gonna tackle something this grand!! The better you know the group you're in, easier it is to anticipate things!! But like you also said - there are always "floaters" or irregular arrivals, having a basic grouping or core will make it easier to adapt to "new" fliers!!


It could be that, as in the Spanish example, the four groups of 25 perform manoeuvres in parallel in their allotted quadrants or even across the window. Who would claim the latter was not valid? <grins>

Felix


#10 goestoeleven

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 06:39 PM

I'm liking this discussion. I like the idea of sticking with a team for most of the week for several reasons that you've already mentioned. The participants learn to anticipate the caller, and the caller learns who can fly which positions for moves like the ball that require inverted hovers, etc.

What do you think of five super teams of twenty, rather than four of twenty five? Twenty might be more manageable as it can split again into two lines of ten. The challenge for a designated caller to yell down the line (all week) for a group of twenty five might be a bit much. With twenty, you can split into two groups of ten with two leaders, or even into four groups of five with four callers (or five groups of four) to work on individual skills. While 25 goes easily into 100, it can't be divided evenly in half, and you'd need five callers if you wanted to split into evenly sized sub-groups from 25.

If you have several "lead" callers, then they can work together to build a composite routine, and you can have every 10th or every 5th person calling the same routine, so the lead caller doesn't have to yell down the whole line. I'm assuming that radios will be used by some callers and participants, but with 100 fliers, it's certain that a fair number of the pilots without radios will be a long way down the line from the leader if it's a group of 25.

Oh yeah . . . I'm planning to be at WSIKF 2013. Tickets will be booked shortly . . . . Posted Image

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#11 Felix Mottram

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:02 PM

<snip>
Oh yeah . . . I'm planning to be at WSIKF 2013. Tickets will be booked shortly . . . . Posted Image


Hi Steve,

I'll have to book soon...

5 x 5 should be tight enough on the ground for calling not to be a problem. <grins>

It would be easy to bring 4 groups of 25 into the grid of 100. 5 groups of 20 does not quite work in the same way...

Wishful thinking anyway!

Felix

#12 stroke survivor

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 08:44 AM

On the topic of leaders being heard - I strongly suggest to anyone coming for the attempt(s), to bring a radio and earpiece!! Saves the leaders voice over that long a period and can individually be adjusted so you can hear well! Our experience with using them at last years "team boot camp", showed how well they can work!! Posted Image Most are sold in sets of 2, and most include rechargeable batteries, charging dock, and some include the earpieces!! All depends on what you're looking to spend, but serviceable units start around $20.00 barebones/no frills and go up from there depending on equipment in the package! Last year I did a brief stint at WSIKF as a leader teaching people new to the "Champions" routine and lost my voice badly!! Radios definitely would have helped!!Posted Image

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#13 Felix Mottram

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 12:11 PM

On the topic of leaders being heard - I strongly suggest to anyone coming for the attempt(s), to bring a radio and earpiece!! Saves the leaders voice over that long a period and can individually be adjusted so you can hear well! Our experience with using them at last years "team boot camp", showed how well they can work!! Posted Image Most are sold in sets of 2, and most include rechargeable batteries, charging dock, and some include the earpieces!! All depends on what you're looking to spend, but serviceable units start around $20.00 barebones/no frills and go up from there depending on equipment in the package! Last year I did a brief stint at WSIKF as a leader teaching people new to the "Champions" routine and lost my voice badly!! Radios definitely would have helped!!Posted Image


As I think has been noted before this may well work for USA based fliers but outsiders cannot buy units on USA frequencies that they can use at home...

Felix

#14 Kitelife

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 02:11 PM

A lot of our fliers have extra radios, we'll just need to get a tally and our expected needs for intl fliers as WISKF approaches, should be fine.

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#15 Felix Mottram

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 02:50 PM

A lot of our fliers have extra radios, we'll just need to get a tally and our expected needs for intl fliers as WISKF approaches, should be fine.


Good news.

Thanks John

Felix




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