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Wind Problems - Please help


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#1 Nekuia

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 04:25 PM

I am hoping that all of you may be able to assist me. Long story short, I recently purchased a Rev. EXP. I am an average kite flier, with some 2 string stunt kite experience, but picked up the EXP not only to learn quads, but because I love the look and feel of flying it. The problem is that while I absolutely love flying my rev, Ohio winds do not love me. Having the misfortune of being in the Ohio miami valley I am constantly faced with having little to no winds. This isn't for a lack of trying, nor is it a new problem, but it is making me more and more frustrated. I REALLY want to get more into kiting, as I cannot express just how relaxing it is to me, but I am stuck when it comes to knowing how to combat the lack of winds. I am aware that there are SUL rev's, like the 1.5, but I don't know how forgiving they are for an amateur to learn a quad. Likewise, I know that the SUL's are rated approximately 1-10 mph winds, but it isn't uncommon for the winds around here to just STOP entirely. Is walking with the kite enough to combat this? In some cases the winds around here are so dead I wonder if an indoor is needed. When considering this, however, I'm worried that if a sudden gust came along it would damage the kite/ line or worse. I am really lost and struggling on what to do. Can any of you offer some advise?

#2 SparkieRob

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 04:54 PM

G'day Nekuia,

Welcome to Revs, "first you like the taste, then you'll love the caving!"

The EXP is a great kite, got one as my first kite start of this year. There are ways to keep your kite up in low winds, and yes it's movement. Before you get another kite, try a 2 wrap frame set. The EXP frame is a 3 wrap (think stronger, stiffer but heavier) and a lighter frame in your kite will get you lower in the wind range. But you will still need to put some effort in. JB has a great tutorial on Kitelife.com about light wind flying but I can't remember if it is for subscribers or not....
Light winds when getting used to Revs can be a pain in the butt, I know.
Any other Revvers in your area that you can meet up with?

Rob.


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#3 Nekuia

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 05:54 PM

Hello Rob,

Thank you for the reply. I have to admit, however, that I do understand the difference in wrap sets. Can you explain this, or is there a page/ article I can review?



#4 RevWizard

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 06:27 PM

There are some threads on this forum that do indeed cover the rods quite well.
Basically the standard rods are 2, 3 and 4 wraps. Identified now days with 2, 3 and 4 feathers. They also have names, but I don't recall the new names off hand.
They originally had gold labels and originally named "Professional Only", "UltraLight" and "Revolution Equipped".
There are special rods such as the race rod black and green.
Your EXP came with a 3 wrap rod, probably without a label.
Search the threads and you will find more in depth details on the rods.

I learned to fly on a REV I with 4 wrap rods in very similar wind conditions. There was no REV 1.5 at that time nor a huge selection of rods.
For your light winds and somewhat erratic winds, I might suggest the black Race Rod.
Why? In my opinion it is as tough as the 3 wrap rod and has the weight close to a 2 wrap rod. It does cost a bit more, however you can use them with all the REV 1.5 Series.
Now if you have problems breaking rods or have the fear there of, I might suggest the almost indestructible Green Race Rod.

I might also suggest that you seek out experienced REV fliers even if you have to travel for an hour or so and pickup some tips from them.

Have Fun with your REV!

Long John (formerly Mr. R)

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#5 Nekuia

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 06:55 PM

Great information. Thank you. In addition to changing the rods should I consider going to a lighter weight line or will that not make a difference? I currently have 90# in 80 and 120 ft.

#6 Jynx

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 07:15 PM

May I suggest that you replace the top leaders, on your handles (with longer leaders)... and place (make) knots every 3/4" or so. Then use the knots to add or decrease the 'brake' (depending on the wind speeds).

Low winds, bring your lines up the knots toward the handles.

Heavy winds, lower your lines (on the knots) away from the handles.

You can see an example of these knots on "Barresi" handle leaders... and its an easy change for your (no-knot-leader) handles! ...and it makes all the difference in the world when it comes to control!

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then there will be peace"

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#7 makatakam

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 07:18 PM

Hello Rob,

Thank you for the reply. I have to admit, however, that I do understand the difference in wrap sets. Can you explain this, or is there a page/ article I can review?




Hi, Nekuia, and welcome to the dark side. I live in Schaumburg (Chicago NW suburb), and must deal with the same crappy, unpredictable Midwest winds as you are. It's either gale-force or no wind at all. I flew today in wind from 0-1.5 mph, occasionally gusting to 2 mph and constantly changing direction, which means lots of thermals rising and air rushing under to fill the void. Not much you can do about it. I flew a home-made rev-like extremely-ultralight on short 40'x50# lines, and still had to move quite a lot to keep it airborne. Lots of work for an old fart like me!

It will be very difficult for you to learn in the kind of conditions that you described without getting some help from an experienced flier. There is one guy in Dayton (don't know how far that is from you). His name is David and he is a member of IKE (Illinois Kite Enthusiasts) of which I am also. Use the link below my signature to register, it's free, and contact him.

I recommend that you exercise a bit of patience and wait until you have 4-10 mph winds to learn in. We (all the Rev fliers in the world) don't want you to become frustrated and give up. Once you gain enough experience=flying time, you'll even be able to have fun when there's no wind at all.

Ok, enough about the wind. Spars come in various Weight/Strength ratios. The number wraps is the amount of "layers" of the carbon fiber cloth that are wrapped onto the mandrel when the tube is manufactured. Obviously, the more wraps one uses, the more material is being used and therefore the weight of the finished spar is directly proportional to the number of wraps. The number of wraps used also determines the stiffness of the spar. More wraps = more weight = more stiffness.

So then,
2-wrap = light weight, flexible spar............light or no-wind flying
3-wrap = medium weight, stiffer spar........normal wind range for the kite
4-wrap = heavy weight, very stiff spar.......heavy winds with strong gusts

Experienced flyers also mix and match different weights and stiffnesses of spars in the same set-up to achieve the "feel" they want for any particular situation.

There are other spars, for instance "race rods" (nothing to do with speed) which are made using different patterns and methods of applying the carbon fiber cloth to the mandrel, baking method and final finish coat, which combine the light weight of a 2-wrap with stiffness of a 3- or 4-wrap. Without getting too technical, that's pretty much all you need to know in a nutshell. If you click on the Rev home page, (look in the upper left corner of the forum page for the link) you can find the replacement spars page in the list at the left of that page, which will give you more info.

Fly your kite with the spars you got with it and don't worry. The kite is quite sturdy and will take a good beating without breaking.

I hope this is of some help to you. Don't get discouraged, smile and have fun. It will all suddenly "click", and you won't even know when it happened.
Mark

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#8 O2bkytn

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 03:06 AM

The problem is that while I absolutely love flying my rev, Ohio winds do not love me. Having the misfortune of being in the Ohio miami valley I am constantly faced with having little to no winds. Likewise, I know that the SUL's are rated approximately 1-10 mph winds, but it isn't uncommon for the winds around here to just STOP entirely.


Hello fellow Ohio guy!
I feel your pain regarding Ohio winds! LOL

Not sure where you are located, but if you can make it to Columbus, there is a group of us that get together pretty much every weekend here. There are at least three, and many times as many of six that fly together. We would be happy to have you join us any time at all.
Our group consists of "REV-O-Holics" of every skill level too. :) Several are very good fliers, One who is just starting out, and a couple of us who have been at it for around a year (Me included). We have a blast together!

We all just watch the weekend weather forecasts and decide whether to get together on Saturday or Sunday each week.

If you are interested in getting together, shoot me an email and we'll work out some details.

O2BKYTN

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#9 cadguy

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 09:26 AM

Hello Nekuia,
Yes, flying any kind of kite in Ohio can be frustrating at times. Been there, done that. I can give you some help/tips to better your learning process. The simplest change is to put more knots on the handle top leaders (aka "pigtails"). I'm not sure how long your top leaders are now, but there may be enough to add 2 more knots - one close to the handle and one in the middle. This should give you enough of a difference to feel what "less brake" (top lines attached closer to the handle) for light winds and "more brake" (top lines attached away from the handles) for more wind feels like.

Also, hold off on buying other frames / kites until you learn how to control what you have now. Plus, you can try my other frames and kites to see what each type feels like.

Where are you trying to fly? We could meet somewhere so that I can welcome you to the Darkside personally. I fly at Delco park (Kettering), Riverscape (downtown), Air Force Museum, etc. , places that typically do not have the smoothest of winds.


"Dayton" David
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#10 Nekuia

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 05:04 PM

Thank you all so much for the great responses. For all of you that offered to meet up and fly together, that sounds like a lot of fun. I will send out some emails to all of you and hopefully we can get something planned.




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