39 replies to this topic

[SynTaks]

Following from what Syntaks, do you know if a marker will stick to the material the Zen is made of. There is a kind of marker with a soft brush-like tip that would be perfect for the small and simple calligraphy I had in mind for the Zen. Now that we've talked about it, though, I'm getting some ambitions about bigger decorations on other kites. Amazing how deep each aspect of this kite business is.

I can't afford a zen or there would be one in my bag, so I don't know if the material is any different than the B-Pro. If not, the fabric paint pens we have works great, though I would suggest doing what I did and practicing on cheaper kites. ;P

[jburka]

I can't afford a zen or there would be one in my bag, so I don't know if the material is any different than the B-Pro.

The B-Pro and the Zen are both made from the same material, Icarex.

[Mitch]

Great tip! I have a Michaels near-by. Did you have to do something special to set the paint? Iron it or anything? or is as easy as that? Thanks! I feel like a bit of a woos, if you all are flying at night in Anchorage. I blew off great winds today because it was raining and 45! Thanks. I'd love to see your pics.

[BillLamm]

Great tip! I have a Michaels near-by. Did you have to do something special to set the paint? Iron it or anything? or is as easy as that? Thanks! I feel like a bit of a woos, if you all are flying at night in Anchorage. I blew off great winds today because it was raining and 45! Thanks. I'd love to see your pics.

I don't think you have to do anything to set the Design Master paint?? the fabric paints, markers and crayons all have specific instructions... I believe the kite fabric needs all the help it can get (from heat) in bonding to the paints...

as soon as I have more play $$ I am going to get some white fabric samples (probably from kitebuilder.com) so I can experiment...

(Question to the 'powers that be' at Revolution) What are the chances of getting some scraps of the white fabric used for rev kites... I am truly interested in painting images on kites... bringing the art out of the galleries and into the sky... I would rather paint on more skillfully built sails than build and paint on mine (especially in the Quad Kite realm)

[Aerial Art]

Greetings Mitch,

Here's a link on my painting techniques http://www.kitebuild...hlight=painting

Also see my Picasa Design Master album at http://picasaweb.google.com/mshampton2

Using Design Master correctly does have a learning curve so practice, practice, practice and wear appropriate respirator.

Scott

[BillLamm]

Greetings Mitch,

Here's a link on my painting techniques http://www.kitebuild...hlight=painting

Also see my Picasa Design Master album at http://picasaweb.google.com/mshampton2

Using Design Master correctly does have a learning curve so practice, practice, practice and wear appropriate respirator.

Scott

Thank you for the links... that about wraps up the Design Master questions for me... I am still curious about Setacolor paints... I am more painterly but the Design Master sparks some great ideas in my head

[SynTaks]

Great tip! I have a Michaels near-by. Did you have to do something special to set the paint? Iron it or anything? or is as easy as that? Thanks! I feel like a bit of a woos, if you all are flying at night in Anchorage. I blew off great winds today because it was raining and 45! Thanks. I'd love to see your pics.

No need to iron. Just give it 24-48 hours to dry. Also...It isn't toxic.


B-Pro

This one was a simple change. The white panels on my kite were slightly stained when I got it, so I decided to do a it bit differently. It is the standard "race hot" B-Pro, but I painted the white panels. Half blue and half green. The photo is showing only the first coating with the paint markers, so you can see a bit of "edging" on it. I'm not really sure if I'm going to do anything with the center or bottom "rocker" panels yet...


1.5 SLE

This one I just wanted a more "rainbow" look, so I started to paint and this is how it ended up. Painting on the Mylar takes longer to dry, but has a great effect because it's still transparent.


RWB 1.5 SUL

This was the kite I started my experimentation with the paint pens we got from Michaels. I had a mishap with the center star so had to come up with a fix. I am, in no way, an artist. I just wanted something different and I originally got this kite for Alaska's 50th anniversary, so I kinda went a bit crazy. If you look, you'll see that there are stripes on the red and blue panels. This was done using the same color pen as the kite color, but a darker shade. It gives it an odd look that really comes in handy on a "partly cloudy" day when both the blue and white panels blend into the sky. I call it the "Tooty Fruty Red White and Blue-tee" ...

I just like to have my kites a bit more personalized and since we have quite a few rev fliers up here (though not a single one of them will come fly with me when it's below freezing, let alone below zero) I wanted to be able to tell which ones were mine so I didn't accidentally start flying someone else's.

Edited by SynTaks, 25 January 2010 - 12:47 AM.

[Mitch]

WOW! Syntaks, I like it, I like it. The red on red looks like it would scintillate in the sun (may you someday get some). Well this has really given me some courage to try it. Amazing that you have plenty of flyers in Anchorage. I live just outside of St. Louis, where the weather is bound to be more hospitable, and I can hardly find one! I'll try to post my attempts.

Also big thanks to Scott for the tutorial about Design Master. Sounds like it works so well on Nylon, it might be worth giving it a try on Icarex. I'm not hurting for Nylon sail so the experiment might be fun.

[REVflyer]

anybody used DesignMaster on fabric that is NOT nylon? (Icarex or polyester rip-stop)

How did you get it to stick and not flake off?

[SynTaks]

WOW! Syntaks, I like it, I like it. The red on red looks like it would scintillate in the sun (may you someday get some). Well this has really given me some courage to try it. Amazing that you have plenty of flyers in Anchorage. I live just outside of St. Louis, where the weather is bound to be more hospitable, and I can hardly find one! I'll try to post my attempts.

Yeah. We are ordering our 9th and 10th rev now. A Blast 2-4 and a Shockwave. If you wanna see why we're ordering the blast, go to Our YouTube Page and watch me and Syn *trying* to use a 1.5 SLE pull us around on the snow. (Yes...it does work, but you need a LOT of wind...) We've been borrowing a friend's regular Blast and even that is barely enough to pull my 250lbs around. I want a shockwave just so I have something that flies differently than a normal B-Pro to make things more interesting. I don't have anyone to show me the more advanced rev tricks up here and the online tutorials are too hard for me to follow. (Not like Ben is gunna come up here or fly me down to Poway, but Ben, if yer reading, I wouldn't say "no" ... hint ... hint...) So I just show people the basics of flying and that's pretty much as far as anyone has gotten up here. (Rev needs a training academy!)

I'm the President of AlasKiters, our kite club, so somewhere along the way I need to figure out a way to get someone up here to really show off the revs. Most of the people I know of who are really talented think we're crazy to LIVE here in Alaska, let alone be out flying at 30 below. I have quite a few people who want to learn to fly for the winter fun in those youtube videos, so I will be busy this spring if my health holds out.

I lived in San Diego a large portion of my life and somehow never saw anyone flying a rev. Same goes for my 15 years in Boulder Colorado, home of the ever popular Into The Wind kite shop. Never saw a rev there either. We happened across them on the web when we took up flying dual line kites...

Now I just gotta study art so I can learn to actually paint something interesting on the kites...lol

TaK

[Mitch]

a. It looks cold and DARK. I wonder if there is a phosphorescent or at least highly reflective paint that would work against the dark and artificial lights. With something like a Shockwave, I can't imagine that the extra weight would make a difference.
b. I couldn't agree more with your idea about a Rev academy. I'd show up. Even in the heartland, I can't find a Guru (forum Guru reference not intended.) Do they have organized lessens at the festivals? Some of the forum strings are pretty informative, as are the Windy with Watty vids, but there's nothing like hands on. By the way, JB was talking about an instructional DVT but where do we get hold of it. Can't find it on the Rev site or Kitelife.
c. Alaska has such a rich art culture and history with native graphics and decorative elements, I'd imagine you could produce some really distinctive local kites. The Zen has the "Ice". You could produce a totem pole kite called, You ain't seen ice!

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[SynTaks]

a. It looks cold and DARK. I wonder if there is a phosphorescent or at least highly reflective paint that would work against the dark and artificial lights. With something like a Shockwave, I can't imagine that the extra weight would make a difference.
b. I couldn't agree more with your idea about a Rev academy. I'd show up. Even in the heartland, I can't find a Guru (forum Guru reference not intended.) Do they have organized lessens at the festivals? Some of the forum strings are pretty informative, as are the Windy with Watty vids, but there's nothing like hands on. By the way, JB was talking about an instructional DVT but where do we get hold of it. Can't find it on the Rev site or Kitelife.
c. Alaska has such a rich art culture and history with native graphics and decorative elements, I'd imagine you could produce some really distinctive local kites. The Zen has the "Ice". You could produce a totem pole kite called, You ain't seen ice!

The dark isn't as bad here in Anch-Morpork (Terry Pratchett version of Anchorage) as it is farther North. We were in Bearflanks (Fairbanks) for the first 4 years and that's a lot darker and a LOT colder.

I've done lights on my rev before. A friend made some 2 LED lightsets for me and over the holidays I rigged up some battery powered xmas lights to string on the leading edge that worked pretty well, but it was like flying a brick. Still did basic moves but I had to fly slowly because they were pretty touchy. It took me awhile to work out a way to connect the controller because it HAD to go in the center of the LE because of the weight. I came up with a decent system simply using rubber bands through the center bridal hole in the sail. I'll put up photos in my gallery and a link to video of it later.

I want one of the all white Zens. I have some ideas for painting that one, but I am disabled so can't really afford to spend the money on that anytime soon.

I am not at a loss for ideas of what to put on the kites. I simply am not good (even in the slightest) at drawing or painting I can fill boxes in with the paint, but I am no artist, so drawing pictures is kind of out of the question for me.

My better 3/4 is better at doing that kind of stuff. I just sit all day and fly them.

I've replaced physical therapy completely with rev flying, as it's the same movements I do for my nerve problems. I've also lost more than 100 pounds in the last year doing it. (I don't fly them like most people. I dance with my kite, though most people think I am having a seizure...

So we need to talk the folks at Rev to start an academy for us...

[BillLamm]

Kite therapy... I love it... start with a vented 1.5 in 5 mph winds.... work your way up to a blast in 15 mph winds... (OK.. there are a few details to be worked out

I am the same on the painting thing... my wife and I do pottery together... I tease her that I make it (create it on the potters wheel)... and she makes it pretty (puts on the handles, carves words and pictures, decides what glaze colors she wants) Same with the kites... I have ideas but I have not done much drawing or painting in the 20 years since college.. and kites are an expensive canvas

[SynTaks]

Kite therapy... I love it... start with a vented 1.5 in 5 mph winds.... work your way up to a blast in 15 mph winds... (OK.. there are a few details to be worked out

I am the same on the painting thing... my wife and I do pottery together... I tease her that I make it (create it on the potters wheel)... and she makes it pretty (puts on the handles, carves words and pictures, decides what glaze colors she wants) Same with the kites... I have ideas but I have not done much drawing or painting in the 20 years since college.. and kites are an expensive canvas

Actually, the physical therapy is just the wrist and arm movements. Then there's the way I make myself setup the kite. I connect the lines to the handles, put those in the stake that we use (It's technically a tent stake I found at Lowes, (Super Stakes) but the top end of the rev handles fit through the rope notches and are held there perfectly.) Then I run the lines out, walk back, walk out & separate left and right, walk back, walk out & separate top and bottom, walk back, get the kite, walk out, hook up the lines, and walk back to the handles to fly. That's 800 feet just doing that. That might not sound like much, but considering I spent the last 15 years in Boulder staring at a computer screen at IBM, add that to the way I fly when I have my music to fly with, it adds up to a lot of exercise ... and I do it every day. I got my Indoor Rev for the days (like today) there isn't any wind so that my ritual isn't broken. I go a bit nuts if I don't get to fly for more than a day. (Ask my wife...she still doesn't get it...) But even she can't complain considering I have lost the 100 pounds...

I credit Revs for keeping me alive longer than the docs did. (Long story, but it is, technically, true.) That's why I wanted a shockwave. I've done everything I can at this point with a rev, and the shockwave will give me something to fly that takes more getting used to. The more I use my thinking, the longer I'll have it to use. Dunno what I'll do after the couple months it'll take me to get to the same point with the shockwave. I'll have to figure out some way to get down to Poway. Ben said he'd show me the more advanced stuff if I got there...lol

The painting will get interesting if I can get ahold of the all white zen. That would keep me busy for a month or two. Anyone else ever use streamers on their rev? I haven't seen anyone other than us do it...

--TaK

Edited by SynTaks, 02 February 2010 - 03:48 PM.

[BillLamm]

Don't take me wrong.... the little physical therapy I have been through taught me that some times we need more motivation than we think... You are getting out in the open air... the wind is forcing you to make subconscious minor adjustments as you are getting your repetitive gross motor work out... I think its awsome
Oh yeah... tails on quads, I like this one... cant find the longer video

[Mitch]

Now it may be that your wives solve this problem, but when I want to paint (or carve) something that is past my VERY MEAGER artistic talents, I sometimes get stamps. There is a whole hobby of people creating complex graphic piece by mixing and matching the images on these rubber stamps and there are a million of them. So I would find the stamp(s) that would provide my outlines. It only works for smaller patterns (say up to 8x8 inches). It's a bit mechanical, but overcomes "the heartbreak of Artistic Apraxia". It's especially good for non-roman alphabets. My calligraphy is not too bad, but if you want something Japanese on your Zen...

For larger patterns Dritz makes a kind of pen that you can trace a pattern onto the sail from a pattern lying beneath it. The ink disappears when dabbed with water. It's in fabric and quilting type stores For most kite sail cloth you would not need a light box to see a patern below the cloth. There is also a thing called a transfer pencil, used mostly for stitching fabric arts. You trace what you want onto tracing paper with this pencil and when you put it face down and iron it, it leaves the pattern on the the cloth. BUT it doesn't wash off.

PS: COOL vid. That guy is fast.

[SynTaks]

So Tak and I found some other painting stuff, its a spray on fabric paint.
This is was a Red/White/Black EXP.
It produces a bit of a different effect than the markers... so heres a bit more of the process since I snuck some pictures in while he was working on it.

Clicky for fullsize
Here you can see some of the "splatter" effect from being a spray-type of paint. I think it looked cool, but he didn't. Maybe its just that yellow on white in a splatter pattern really isn't that cool.


Clicky for fullsize
An even better picture of splatter. As you can see, it keeps the transparency with one coat, which is why I liked the spotty pattern.


Clicky for fullsize
Half of the big picture. As norm, Tak has a tendency for painting on the back of kites. Something to do with the way the light shines through the panels. After the first coat, I found a foam brush I had laying around and that solved his dislike of the splatter pattern, and opened up a whole new artistic can of worms. [Blue tape not included. Hopefully he'll have a picture of it on a nice sky backdrop from the colorado trip].

Overall we're pretty happen with the liquid spray fabric paint. Its just a regular spray bottle type. The last picture has 2 coats on it, and it doesn't take very long to dry inside. The directions do call for 72hrs before washing on regular fabric. I don't know how that type of paint would work on already colored panels.

On a side note, he also had picked up a can of aerosol silver paint, which we thought would work just as well to paint a stencil on the black panels of the new shockwave. If you're even thinking of using this type of paint, get the stick on stencils.

[Mitch]

So Tak and I found some other painting stuff, its a spray on fabric paint.
This is was a Red/White/Black EXP.
It produces a bit of a different effect than the markers... so heres a bit more of the process since I snuck some pictures in while he was working on it.

Clicky for fullsize
Here you can see some of the "splatter" effect from being a spray-type of paint. I think it looked cool, but he didn't. Maybe its just that yellow on white in a splatter pattern really isn't that cool.


Clicky for fullsize
An even better picture of splatter. As you can see, it keeps the transparency with one coat, which is why I liked the spotty pattern.


Clicky for fullsize
Half of the big picture. As norm, Tak has a tendency for painting on the back of kites. Something to do with the way the light shines through the panels. After the first coat, I found a foam brush I had laying around and that solved his dislike of the splatter pattern, and opened up a whole new artistic can of worms. [Blue tape not included. Hopefully he'll have a picture of it on a nice sky backdrop from the colorado trip].

Overall we're pretty happen with the liquid spray fabric paint. Its just a regular spray bottle type. The last picture has 2 coats on it, and it doesn't take very long to dry inside. The directions do call for 72hrs before washing on regular fabric. I don't know how that type of paint would work on already colored panels.

On a side note, he also had picked up a can of aerosol silver paint, which we thought would work just as well to paint a stencil on the black panels of the new shockwave. If you're even thinking of using this type of paint, get the stick on stencils.

[Mitch]

Nice. I like it. Looks like a flag, but I can't figure out which. Germany is red in the middle...

I'd be interested to see the silver spray. Does it add a lot of weight?

[SynTaks]

Nice. I like it. Looks like a flag, but I can't figure out which. Germany is red in the middle...

I'd be interested to see the silver spray. Does it add a lot of weight?

I was digging around old threads for fun, and I think that actually makes it the same color scheme as an indoor. Which I was hmming and hawing about commenting on my dislike for having black as the bottom panels on the kite... its a pain to see in the dark!

When we were painting, we were expecting it to drip and run everywhere, and it really didn't. Just used some leftover printer paper to catch overspray. Now the silver on the other hand would not be blocked at all by paper. I think I'm going to experiment with that later in the week.

As far as the weight of it, its not noticeable when you're handling the kite, but it is an EXP after all. Tak hasn't really had enough real wind to work with to compare it to another kite yet, so more to come on that part later.