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International Register of 'Revolution' Team Fliers


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#1 Felix Mottram

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Posted 26 December 2009 - 12:25 PM

I wonder if it would be useful to set up a register of potential participants in large scale events, internationally?

I have also 'wondered' if potential participants would subscribe to a small organisation which might be set up to 'further their interests'?

Circular enquiry, I know, but interested to know if there would be any substantial response.

Felix

#2 Kitelife

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Posted 26 December 2009 - 12:32 PM

Realizing that budgets and availability being in flux from year to year, I know iQuad would be interested in both a register and a dedicated organization.

John Barresi

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#3 Felix Mottram

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Posted 26 December 2009 - 12:38 PM

Realizing that budgets and availability being in flux from year to year, I know iQuad would be interested in both a register and a dedicated organization.


Is it something that the 'Revolution' company could/should undertake or should it be a* 'completely' independent 'dedicated organisation'?

Felix

Edit a*

Edited by Felix Mottram, 26 December 2009 - 12:42 PM.


#4 Kitelife

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Posted 26 December 2009 - 12:42 PM

Independent, without a shadow of a doubt.

It's a flier undertaking, not a factory undertaking.

It takes every day fliers to know the subject.

John Barresi

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#5 Felix Mottram

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Posted 26 December 2009 - 12:46 PM

Independent, without a shadow of a doubt.

It's a flier undertaking, not a factory undertaking.

It takes every day fliers to know the subject.


That is my feeling also, but obviously there are strings attached...

Sticking with the factory product would be one that looms large immediately.

Felix

#6 Kitelife

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Posted 26 December 2009 - 02:23 PM

So, make it an organizational standard, and include the name Revolution in the title, with Rev's blessing of course.

It's good for both parties.

John Barresi

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#7 Scott_of_melnsct

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Posted 26 December 2009 - 08:56 PM

That is my feeling also, but obviously there are strings attached...

Sticking with the factory product would be one that looms large immediately.

Felix



Do you mean whether or not to insist on factory Revs? or are you saying factory product is a must?
Scott A Koenig
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#8 Felix Mottram

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Posted 26 December 2009 - 11:51 PM

Do you mean whether or not to insist on factory Revs? or are you saying factory product is a must?


Fliers who fly Revolution Kites which are made by or licensed by Revolution Kites...??

This is conversational OK! <grins>

Felix

#9 Felix Mottram

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Posted 26 December 2009 - 11:52 PM

So, make it an organizational standard, and include the name Revolution in the title, with Rev's blessing of course.

It's good for both parties.


Sounds sensible to me...

Felix

#10 Kitelife

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 01:17 AM

Bear in mind Scott, there are a few teams out there in the world who fly on 'Rev style' kites they made for themselves, either for budgetary or design tweaking reasons...

At the end of the day, Revolution has become a standard, I'm certain we will continue to maintain that standard as you see it now and beyond.

There's no implication of oppression or exclusivity here, I encourage you not to let the theme we're discussing change what you know of this community. ;)

Some specificity is appropriate with such an undertaking, assuredly... Will such an organization turn you (or Flic) down if you showed up with non-factory kites?

I won't even answer that, as you know the answer.

Fly for love.

John Barresi

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#11 Felix Mottram

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 06:21 AM

Bear in mind Scott, there are a few teams out there in the world who fly on 'Rev style' kites they made for themselves, either for budgetary or design tweaking reasons...

At the end of the day, Revolution has become a standard, I'm certain we will continue to maintain that standard as you see it now and beyond.

There's no implication of oppression or exclusivity here, I encourage you not to let the theme we're discussing change what you know of this community. ;)

Some specificity is appropriate with such an undertaking, assuredly... Will such an organization turn you (or Flic) down if you showed up with non-factory kites?

I won't even answer that, as you know the answer.

Fly for love.


If the objective is to 'fly together' team fliers have an interest in using 'standard' kit. At a couple of events this year we flew Rev 1 and Rev 1.5 kites together in a mega team so there is some scope for adopting different kit as well... (16 JMH sails looked very cool!)

Felix

#12 Scott_of_melnsct

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 06:53 AM

The need for a standard is two-fold. Everybody in a team fly wants that fly to go well and be fun to be a part of; if somebody's kite has inferior flying characteristics then the odds of a mishap go up. Also, an inferior kite will be viewed by the public as an inferior rev and that's plain bad for business. As Rev fliers we need Rev to continue to look good.

All that being said, I understand that the most efficient standard would be to say this is "Revolution" organization. The next level of team standards is much more problematic, and that's ability. for example: A badkite in JB's hands is still likely to fly better than his kite in my hands (and I'm not particularly bad)

Just some more food for thought.
Scott A Koenig
Founding member: Tennessee Wind Militia
"We muster to fly at a moment's notice"

#13 Felix Mottram

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 07:17 AM

The need for a standard is two-fold. Everybody in a team fly wants that fly to go well and be fun to be a part of; if somebody's kite has inferior flying characteristics then the odds of a mishap go up. Also, an inferior kite will be viewed by the public as an inferior rev and that's plain bad for business. As Rev fliers we need Rev to continue to look good.

All that being said, I understand that the most efficient standard would be to say this is "Revolution" organization. The next level of team standards is much more problematic, and that's ability. for example: A badkite in JB's hands is still likely to fly better than his kite in my hands (and I'm not particularly bad)

Just some more food for thought.


For the International Register of 'Revolution' Team Fliers we need fliers who have compatible kit.

We need fliers who can comfortably 'own their hover' and have no thoughts of having 'superior' capability or equipment... <grins>

Another twist maybe?

Felix

#14 Stone in Shoe Bob

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 08:12 AM

Can we have some clarification here please Felix? Are you talking about Register of teams, if so I can’t see the point surely you all know who you are, or are you talking about a register of individuals to join a potential mega team?

If it’s the latter, I’m wondering if you could be making a rod for your own (or somebody else’s) back with this one. A mega fly needs a leader and surely the leader needs to be free to be able to vet and have confidence in the abilities of all those in the team. I don’t want to say too much on the subject for fear of causing offence and reopening old grievances, but there is a danger that anyone accepted onto any register will consider they have a licence to fly.

I'm not saying any register is necessarily a bad idea but I think it is important that expectations are carefully managed. I think/hope that I am aware of my limitations, I know there are others out there who are not.

Edited by Stone in Shoe Bob, 27 December 2009 - 08:13 AM.

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#15 Kitelife

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 11:19 AM

If I understand correctly, the idea behind such a register is to identify our global pool of capable team fliers.

Correct Felix?

So I'll ask the next question before anyone else, and provide my my thoughts.

Who decides if someone is an able team pilot that can aptly handle mega flies?

To this, the quick answer, would be the panel selected/formed to organize and document such a register, ideally a panel of good folks (i.e. Felix, Hoath, myself and others who have the knowledge and experience to LEAD such mega team undertakings)... They are proven opinions, generally fair, and as long as there is a broad enough representation of geography and personalities on such a panel, it would be fair, if not sometimes rather executive.

My 2 cents.

John Barresi

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#16 Felix Mottram

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 11:45 AM

Can we have some clarification here please Felix? Are you talking about Register of teams, if so I canít see the point surely you all know who you are, or are you talking about a register of individuals to join a potential mega team?

If itís the latter, Iím wondering if you could be making a rod for your own (or somebody elseís) back with this one. A mega fly needs a leader and surely the leader needs to be free to be able to vet and have confidence in the abilities of all those in the team. I donít want to say too much on the subject for fear of causing offence and reopening old grievances, but there is a danger that anyone accepted onto any register will consider they have a licence to fly.

I'm not saying any register is necessarily a bad idea but I think it is important that expectations are carefully managed. I think/hope that I am aware of my limitations, I know there are others out there who are not.


Bob,

It was in the title 'Revolution' Team Fliers. The teams, as you intimate, are quite capable of looking after themselves.

The issues further down the line are for discussion. Again though, the title says it. A register of fliers capable of team flying.

The initial issue is finding a line of communication to as many 'team fliers' as is possible. A 'mailing list' that goes to the 'inbox' of every individual who considers themselves capable seems to me to be a 'practical' starting point.

Felix

#17 Stone in Shoe Bob

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 11:48 AM

Thanks John.
Stone in Shoe Bob

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#18 Kitelife

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 11:57 AM

Does the idea I outlined make sense to you Bob, or up for debate?

In my experience, at some point, someone has to make the call, and it's impossible to please everyone all the time.

However, by establishing such a register, I also believe it will help distribute more team knowledge worldwide, so while someone might be politely declined from the register from time to time, the channels, support and encouragement are in place to learn the standards that will allow them to succeed.

Consider it faculty, whereas we'll always have students coming up and surpassing the ranks. :)

(btw - great topic Felix - carry on)

John Barresi

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#19 Felix Mottram

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 11:59 AM

If I understand correctly, the idea behind such a register is to identify our global pool of capable team fliers.

Correct Felix?

So I'll ask the next question before anyone else, and provide my my thoughts.

Who decides if someone is an able team pilot that can aptly handle mega flies?

To this, the quick answer, would be the panel selected/formed to organize and document such a register, ideally a panel of good folks (i.e. Felix, Hoath, myself and others who have the knowledge and experience to LEAD such mega team undertakings)... They are proven opinions, generally fair, and as long as there is a broad enough representation of geography and personalities on such a panel, it would be fair, if not sometimes rather executive.

My 2 cents.


JB,

A register to identify our global pool of potentially capable (OK Mega) team fliers would be the objective at the outset. Many organisations 'advocating professional standards' start this way as far as I am aware.

Discussion of capability would be secondary to individuals 'putting themselves forward' knowing that scrutiny would take place and that 'critically', the leader of an event would have complete discretion on the day and that the individuals would be bound to accept any decision by that leader.

You know that my personal hope is that one day a 100 person team will be possible. I am interested to establish if there is sufficient interest in such a project but obviously keen to see Mega Team events develop along the way.

Felix

#20 Kitelife

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 12:03 PM

Discussion of capability would be secondary to individuals 'putting themselves forward' knowing that scrutiny would take place and that 'critically', the leader of an event would have complete discretion on the day and that the individuals would be bound to accept any decision by that leader.

Gospel, pure gospel... 100% spot on.

John Barresi

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