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Why double up when you have an SLE?


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#1 kairusan

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Posted 21 May 2009 - 09:51 PM

Yes, SLEs are totally sucky and are only meant for staking tomato plants, holding up flags, pole-vaulting across chasms, beating people who have annoyed you without causing serious injury, hanging tapestries from your office wall (I'm actually using one right now for that exact purpose), and so on.

Everyone knows this. I used to think different when I knew naught else, but then Santa Claus brought me some Race Rods and well........... yeah. Time to use the SLE to hang tapestries from my office wall, because, yeah, Race Rods, OMG. Lots of other proper frame parts followed. Money was spent. Fun was had. Etc. etc.

But golly gee, here I was futzing about with my kites in the living room (something that oh-so-annoys the wife whene'er I do it, which is evidently way too often), and in the process, I decide to do a little comparison test between my 4-wrap+3-wrap leading edge configuration (the accepted and approved method of flying a Rev in winds above 30mph), and my 4-wrap SLE (which is so utterly without any conceivable rational purpose that it doesn't even get to live on my office wall like the 3-wrap one, and instead has to reside in the forgotten depths of my coat closet).

Noticed a few things:

(1) the 4+3 and the 4-wrap SLE seem exactly, precisely, and completely as stiff as one another. Like, I couldn't even bend the 4+3 barely at all, and the SLE, same diff. If anything, the SLE felt slightly MORE flexible. Huh?!?!?

(2) the 4-wrap SLE felt LIGHTER than the 4+3. That's a good thing, right?

(3) the 4-wrap SLE fit much, much nicer into my leading edge pocket thing than did the double-stuff rods, was waaaaaaaaaay easier to get in and out, and seemed to allow the vertical spars to pivot effortlessly (compared to the double-stuff method, which significantly impedes the movement of the vertical spars).

Given the above, why is it acceptable to use the 4+3 wrap double-stuff method in winds above 30, but never acceptable to use the SLE outside of agricultural, human discipline, tapestry hanging, and other non-kite-related applications?

Kindly explain, because I'm getting dangerously close to actually wanting to keep an SLE in my kite bag again. Help!
kairusan

#2 Baloo

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Posted 21 May 2009 - 10:08 PM

OK :devil:

Question 1, dont know the answer to that one, the only SLE's I have are staying in my Blasts. Where they work very well thank you. :o

Question 2, sometimes more weight is better, sometimes less weight, depends a bit on the Day of the Week, Month, Year etc. :P (personal choice most often)

Question 3, I would think sometimes it is easier / quicker to slide anothe LE in, especialy in a howling wind than do a LE swap to a SLE. :unsure:

Answer to the unasked question, no self respecting Rev flier would be seen with a SLE in thier kite. :ninja:

Proper answer, you fly with whatever makes you feel good, even put a turned down broomstick in there if it works for you. Just cuz other folks shy away from SLE's no reason why you should. Just expect to be pushed off to the Dog Poop corner of the flying field and shunned by all other fliers. (only joking) :D

#3 Jonesey

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Posted 22 May 2009 - 12:54 AM

I think its convenience and one less thing to carry more then anything else... If you have a dedicated heavy weather kite (super vent, tea bag etc) then its easy .. I have an all mesh kite that I cobbled together and fly it with a 4 wrap in breeze I wouldn't want to trash my B's in ..... so I never double stuff the leading edge and before I had that I had washers on my end caps and arent too proud to admit I used my SLE ... makes perfect sense to me ...I kind of think that in the weather you need to double stuff its more about survival then precision and there is also more chance something is going to break so I'm with you and its SLE every time ;)

Oh and this years runner beans are currently climbing up some broken 3, race and 4 wrap rods in my garden!

#4 Jeepster

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Posted 22 May 2009 - 04:45 AM

...
(1) the 4+3 and the 4-wrap SLE seem exactly, precisely, and completely as stiff as one another. Like, I couldn't even bend the 4+3 barely at all, and the SLE, same diff. If anything, the SLE felt slightly MORE flexible. Huh?!?!?

(2) the 4-wrap SLE felt LIGHTER than the 4+3. That's a good thing, right?

(3) the 4-wrap SLE fit much, much nicer into my leading edge pocket thing than did the double-stuff rods, was waaaaaaaaaay easier to get in and out, and seemed to allow the vertical spars to pivot effortlessly (compared to the double-stuff method, which significantly impedes the movement of the vertical spars).

Given the above, why is it acceptable to use the 4+3 wrap double-stuff method in winds above 30, but never acceptable to use the SLE outside of agricultural, human discipline, tapestry hanging, and other non-kite-related applications?

Kindly explain, because I'm getting dangerously close to actually wanting to keep an SLE in my kite bag again. Help!


Your mileage may vary, but:

1) The one 3-wrap SLE leading edge that I measured would only deflect about 70% as much as the 4+3 wrap. Both set ups are very stiff, so it's hard to tell the difference without using a dial indicator.

2) The 3-wrap SLE rod weighted 80% of what a 4+3 wrap double-stuff weighed ... so yes, it is actually lighter. The weight difference is enough that you can feel it in your hands. However, when you've got to put rocks in your pockets to fly, weight probably isn't so much of an issue.

Your observations are right on ... the SLE is lighter and nominally as stiff as a 4+3 wrap.

Now if you can convince some of the flyers to fore go the veggies this year and do an "in the air" comparison of the SLE to a 4+3 wrap in high winds that would be informative.

I practice what Jonesey says ... put the B-series away when the winds get in the 30mph range. Don't have enough kites to risk stretching or tearing the sail, plus they're just not fun to fly in those types of winds. Now, Big Bri's mega vent is a horse of another color ... it has the same effect on high winds as a Catholic nun with a ruler and a scowl has on her students ... quiets the winds right down. If only Ben would offer them up for sale ... do it in a B-series sail and call them the BIG B.

Cheers,
Tom

#5 FortFlyer

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Posted 22 May 2009 - 09:54 AM

Its pretty simple, The 4+3 wrap or 3+3 wrap doubled up has nothing to do with the wraps really its the diameter of the rod the 1/4" rods allow for the sail to bend and bellow as the SLE holds the sail flatter. The flatter sail is not as precise as a bellowed sail it has something to do with how the wind it sheeted off.

Notice when you use a SLE the kite is twitchy and not as precise as when you use the 1/4" rods same happens in higher wind just much faster.

Feel free to use whatever you want in any wind situation after all YOU are flying the kite not me or whomever comments on THEIR preferences but in time you will probably realize that SLE's have their place, Just that most of us do not know where that is apart from the veggie garden. B)
Jim,
Ft. Taber Park & Brenton Point

Rev's are like a carbon framed out-of-body experience

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#6 Baloo

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Posted 22 May 2009 - 01:06 PM

Oh and this years runner beans are currently climbing up some broken 3, race and 4 wrap rods in my garden!

No broken SLE spars then Jonesey? You obviously dont have the wind!!




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