111 replies to this topic

[Sailor99]

I had a go with David Ellison's once and really liked them. They certainly made reversing much, much easier. I don't think I would want the extra weight, partly as you need more lift to get going and partly because of the momentum, for really tight precision stuff. Also there is all the extra faff of setting them up. But I can see a good argument for using them in team flying where the pace of moves is often set by the person who is having to reverse (eg return to ball pace set by the person who is reversing up from the bottom, so a fast return is not really on).

I think I am going to stick with the standard set up and learn my flying the 'proper' way. I figure I won't pick up bad habits that way. Once I am elderly and infirm I may resort to quad sticks to improve my mobility!

[david ellison]

Once I am elderly and infirm I may resort to quad sticks to improve my mobility!

ouch that hurts!

Last time out I went back to the standard set up to get a feel for the difference again. Didn't last long though and I reverted to my quadstick version. I enjoy the more direct feedback it gives me. I find it far more precise, snappier in turns and so responsive. Pretty much the opposite to what you thought Jeremy/Sailor. It was a low wind day and flying with 2 wraps the sticky version had just as much lift as the vanilla.
Its that muscle memory thing again! You tend to prefer what you're used to.

[Choccy]

It was a low wind day and flying with 2 wraps the sticky version had just as much lift as the vanilla.

There's nothing ordinary about your Devonshire vanilla David

Damien (Crazy Driver) had a test fly of our B-series standard without quadsticks (which he loves to use).
He didn't really like the response without the quadsticks.
Without QS the kite tends to bowtie (which he showed us).

I've not tried it with quadsticks yet, wouldn't mind a go.

What I am more curious about is that most major teams seem to have alot more bridle added to stop the brake lines from moving around!
It is more precise for them.
Check out the extra bridle on Stephen's rev here.

It's all about choice

[david ellison]

Variations on the widenend bridle are the norm in Europe and flown to great success by some ace pilots. They tend to add sticks too. I've "fiddled" with my bridle many times (ask Gary/ play365 he always had a good laugh at them). Since playing with quadsticks though I've gone back to a standard bridle and found the sweetspot I was looking for.

I didn't know Stephen was a bridle fiddler! I'll have a look at Exmouth next week.

[Sailor99]

You know you are right about muscle memory David. I think I may have a go at making up some magic sticks after all!

[play365]

Variations on the widenend bridle are the norm in Europe and flown to great success by some ace pilots. They tend to add sticks too. I've "fiddled" with my bridle many times (ask Gary/ play365 he always had a good laugh at them). Since playing with quadsticks though I've gone back to a standard bridle and found the sweetspot I was looking for.

I didn't know Stephen was a bridle fiddler! I'll have a look at Exmouth next week.

Yeh he cant help himself he has to fiddle as for Stephen's i seem to remember the Crazy Drivers taking his kite away and putting all that stuff on he is supposed to be taking it all off ?

[Ninjak2k]

Found your site with a few pictures on it, Scott (http://magicquadstic...om/Welcome.html). Any more updates on the Magic Quad Sticks?

~Dan

Edited by Ninjak2k, 25 July 2010 - 10:54 AM.

[Lavarr]

Hi,
I know this is a old topic, I was reading this and found the original project for the rev 1.5 by Guido Maiocchi...
In the project you can find all the details for the magic sticks ("accrocchio" in italian btw) and also 2 different bridle design (interesting imo).
the project is for a complete rev 1.5 with a custom vented paneling (mabye some of you see this paneling in some videos).
Hope you enjoy

http://sites.google....-di-costruzione

[Theresa]

Found your site with a few pictures on it, Scott (http://magicquadstic...om/Welcome.html). Any more updates on the Magic Quad Sticks?

~Dan

Wow, this is an old post.....but NOT forgotten!

When Scott was in and out of here for a couple months....we worked on this....and just about have a finished package ready. Scott is working on some text instructions to be included in the packaging. When that's ready....we'll be a lot closer!

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[aile_mt]

Hi all, I have a question. What is the function of quadsticks?

For bending vartical rods? Or for bending leading edge? Or...?

[stroke survivor]

Hi all, I have a question. What is the function of quadsticks?

For bending vartical rods? Or for bending leading edge? Or...?

The quad sticks are there to stiffen the frame, but NOT to bend it!! It changes the weight distribution and affects the glide angle of the kite when you turn LE down!! Also used to hold the kite up slightly as you attach the lines and then you fly off!! Some like 'em, some don't!! Your call!

[aile_mt]

The quad sticks are there to stiffen the frame, but NOT to bend it!! It changes the weight distribution and affects the glide angle of the kite when you turn LE down!! Also used to hold the kite up slightly as you attach the lines and then you fly off!! Some like 'em, some don't!! Your call!

Oh, I see, to stiffen the frame. I thought that the quad sticks would be to make 3D shape sail like Benson Airbow.

[stroke survivor]

Oh, I see, to stiffen the frame. I thought that the quad sticks would be to make 3D shape sail like Benson Airbow.

Nope, just stiffen it!! Look close at the 2nd pic of Scotty, you'll see that there is no bending, just reenforcement!!

[RevWizard]

Hi all, I have a question. What is the function of quadsticks?

For bending vartical rods? Or for bending leading edge? Or...?

One of the most renowned users of quad sticks is the multiple time winner of the STACK EuroCup Guido Maiocchi of Italy.
Quad sticks improves dramatically various tricks such as axels and flic-flacs.
Besides that it are great parking standoffs.

[Madquad]

[kwmf]

The quad sticks are there to stiffen the frame, but NOT to bend it!! It changes the weight distribution and affects the glide angle of the kite when you turn LE down!! Also used to hold the kite up slightly as you attach the lines and then you fly off!!

Forgive me for asking a bunch of stupid questions but...

Would changing to a stiffer frame not be a simpler method of getting a stiffer frame since both methods add weight?

Would adding weight to the endcaps not be a simpler method of changing weight distribution?

Could one not just use the handles to control the angle of the kite in an inverted glide?

As for standing the kite up, personally I prefer to have it flat and unaffected by the wind or staked down inverted .... but thats just me.


I'm sure I'm in for a solid roasting by the fans, but unless one wants to stiffen the frame, change he balance and not use the handles when inverted all in a single mod .... I'm a little unsure how needed this kind of arrangement is.

That said, even if it does nothing more than make you fly better just because you believe it will, I guess that is a worthwhile effort.

[ahofer]

I've never tried them (although, in theory, Scott owes me a set). I got interested when I tried to fly and park on ice. You can't put your stake in the ice, and the leading and trailing edges don't stick to it either.

[play365]

Forgive me for asking a bunch of stupid questions but...

Would changing to a stiffer frame not be a simpler method of getting a stiffer frame since both methods add weight?

Would adding weight to the endcaps not be a simpler method of changing weight distribution?

Could one not just use the handles to control the angle of the kite in an inverted glide?

As for standing the kite up, personally I prefer to have it flat and unaffected by the wind or staked down inverted .... but thats just me.


I'm sure I'm in for a solid roasting by the fans, but unless one wants to stiffen the frame, change he balance and not use the handles when inverted all in a single mod .... I'm a little unsure how needed this kind of arrangement is.

That said, even if it does nothing more than make you fly better just because you believe it will, I guess that is a worthwhile effort.

it makes reversing easier ? never felt the need myself

[aile_mt]

One of the most renowned users of quad sticks is the multiple time winner of the STACK EuroCup Guido Maiocchi of Italy.
Quad sticks improves dramatically various tricks such as axels and flic-flacs.
Besides that it are great parking standoffs.

I have tryed to imitate the quad sticks years ago with his video, I knew nothing, I set vertical rods curved slightly. I could do axels easier than without quad sticks.

Thanks photo Madquad. Vertical rods seem straight.

Would changing to a stiffer frame not be a simpler method of getting a stiffer frame since both methods add weight?

Would adding weight to the endcaps not be a simpler method of changing weight distribution?

I have same questions, however, now I'm training axels without quad sticks.

[Khal]

Would changing to a stiffer frame not be a simpler method of getting a stiffer frame since both methods add weight?

Would adding weight to the endcaps not be a simpler method of changing weight distribution?

Could one not just use the handles to control the angle of the kite in an inverted glide?

This topic has been dormant for a while, but since I recently started using a set of quad sticks I thought I'd chime in.

The sticks create a sort of truss that directly affects the stiffness of how the wings rotate with respect to each other. A heavier frame doesn't do this. The sticks also affect how the kite flexes in response to load, similar to the way that a heavier frame would. As pointed out by REVFlyer, the extra stiffness may allow the use of a lighter frame than could otherwise be used in the conditions. So the sticks have the potential to add stiffness without adding any weight, possibly even reducing weight.

Adding weight to the endcaps can shift the center of gravity toward or away from the wingtips. The sticks shift the center toward the wingtips, but they also shift it out of the plane of the sail. Weights cannot do that. And again, sticks have the potential to shift the balance without adding any net weight.

The combination of increased stiffness and altered balance (withoud necessarily adding weight) seems to create the effects favored by fans of the sticks. You can always control the glide angle with the handles, but it's more a matter of what the kite naturally "wants" to do on its own. Kites with sticks really like to float, even with slack lines.

I've recently started using a set of 12" sticks (the length I could get in a kit) on my B std and I feel that they improve the light wind performance quite a bit. Floating is more effortless and gaining ground is easier. Recovery is also easier. Reversing is improved with less tendency to bowtie or flip a wing. These characteristics are very helpful in teaching, as well as in my own flying. I haven't noticed any improvement to axels and flic-flacs, but I'm still a beginner at slackline stuff. I haven't tried them yet in a vented or midvent, mainly out of laziness. Nor have I tried the 16" sticks that some prefer.

As far as I know, Rev never made quad sticks available as a commercial product. I know you can get them in an easy, ready to install kit (12") from Elliott Shook at Flying Smiles Kites (http://www.flyingsmileskites.com/) where I got mine. I think You can also get them from Theresa at The Kite Shop (http://thekiteshoppe.com/) though I couldn't find them on the website. I'm not sure if Scott Weider (http://magicquadstic...om/Welcome.html) sells them directly or not.