53 replies to this topic

[TeeCee]

Something about the challenge, especially with an audience watching. <grin>

Has anyone else noticed that, deep down, Barresi is a ham?

I agree with John in principal that most change will come from the fliers, but the topic here is better asset management. That means fliers are pushing at the problem from the bottom up and AKA pushes from the top down because we got on their case and asked them to help. I call this the 'arbor press' method of problem resolution.

And if I may be so bold as to point out, there are some AKA BoD Members who have gone to the Dark Side; Amy Doran, John Gillespie, Greg Lamareaux (RDs), Jim Cosca (DaL), and Sherrie Pigeon (Secretary/DaL). Not a clear majority, but enough of a presence that there is a good deal of influence available in high places to make positive changes.

But however cool these folks might be because they fly quads, they are NOT mind readers. Write 'em.

[Felix Mottram]

Felix, I think it's safe to say that iQuad mirrors your sentiments in this area, as we do have a few US quad team competitions under our belt... Although I know I speak for at least 4 or 5 of our members in saying that we also truly enjoy and thrive on performing in insanely difficult flying conditions as well, be it wind-related or space limitations... Something about the challenge, especially with an audience watching. <grin>

We never had much in the way of spare line sets or kites so have always been risk averse.

Felix

[Kitelife]

Well said TeeCee, no arguments there... Not even on the ham.

I hadn't considered how many of the AKA RDs and Directors have come over to the dark side recently, very true!

Sherri Pigeon, Jim Cosca, Greg Lamoureux, Gayle Woodul, Amy Doran, John Gillespie, Ben Dantonio, makes 7 officers in all...

14 others who aren't "quad fliers" per se, but at least 4-5 are "quad friendly" and receptive to any worthwhile quad ideas.

So, 1/3 of the AKA officers are comprised of people who fly quads (among other kites), very cool indeed.

[Kitelife]

TeeCee, have you looked at the sport kite committee roster recently?

If the information I'm looking at is right, the SKC is down in size, significantly, with vacant commissioner positions for those areas least active in sport kite competition...

Per the AKA web site:

Sport Kites

* Chair: Russ Faulk
* Doug Charleville
* Ron Graziano
* Todd Haymans
* Jeff McCown
* Indoor Events: Bill Rogers
* AKA Delegates to the International Rule Book Committee: Jim Barber & John Barresi (should be Russ Faulk)
* World Sport Kite Championships: David Gomberg
* Competition Conference Commission
o North East: Ruth Polifrone
o South East: Laura Stonestreet
o Central: Vacant
o Midwest: Ann Vondriska
o Northwest: Terri & Mike Huff
o Pacific: Vacant
o Conference Scorekeeper: Tracy Erzin

For those interested, this roster can be found here, along with key email addresses...

http://aka.kite.org/...html#sportkites

[Felix Mottram]

Well said TeeCee, no arguments there... Not even on the ham.

I hadn't considered how many of the AKA RDs and Directors have come over to the dark side recently, very true!

Sherri Pigeon, Jim Cosca, Greg Lamoureux, Gayle Woodul, Amy Doran, John Gillespie, Ben Dantonio, makes 7 officers in all...

14 others who aren't "quad fliers" per se, but at least 4-5 are "quad friendly" and receptive to any worthwhile quad ideas.

So, 1/3 of the AKA officers are comprised of people who fly quads (among other kites), very cool indeed.

It was in 1992 that The Decs attended the AKA convention along with JMH at Lubbock, Texas. We noted then and at WSIKF in 1994 that the US events focused on competition and wondered if this was really the best way to develop interest and involvement in kiting. Since then we have become 'middle aged' if not overweight as Jeremy mentions.

The audiences at European events appear to be substantially larger than anything that I am aware of on the left side of the pond. Montreal was fairly well attended as I recall... 1997 I think!

Felix

[TeeCee]

TeeCee, have you looked at the sport kite committee roster recently?

If the information I'm looking at is right, the SKC is down in size, significantly, with vacant commissioner positions for those areas least active in sport kite competition...

Per the AKA web site:

Sport Kites

* Chair: Russ Faulk
* Doug Charleville
* Ron Graziano
* Todd Haymans
* Jeff McCown
* Indoor Events: Bill Rogers
* AKA Delegates to the International Rule Book Committee: Jim Barber & John Barresi (should be Russ Faulk)
* World Sport Kite Championships: David Gomberg
* Competition Conference Commission
o North East: Ruth Polifrone
o South East: Laura Stonestreet
o Central: Vacant
o Midwest: Ann Vondriska
o Northwest: Terri & Mike Huff
o Pacific: Vacant
o Conference Scorekeeper: Tracy Erzin

For those interested, this roster can be found here, along with key email addresses...

http://aka.kite.org/...html#sportkites

I hadn't gone there, but I'm glad YOU did... if that Central CC spot is still open after I can get my dues paid up again I'm thinking I might do something about that particular vacancy!

TeeCee

[Harrier]

As a divertion it might be worth having a look at this idea from those nice folk at FA, the competition which is currently run by Zippy8 really makes good use of the Internet and allows for a proper World Wide competition, for them as needs to compete.
With a little modification it could attract folk that have done with competeing too.

http://fracturedaxel...1b84c074c98312b

[monkey]

Well said TeeCee, no arguments there... Not even on the ham.

With a sliver of cheese too?



As John suggest, yes, I do agree with how he feels with regards to competition. When I first started flying, I vowed I'd never bother with comps, preferring to fly simply for the fun of it. And I did just that for 8 years. Eventually, I did get into competing (and, to be fair, I really did enjoy it a lot, and have 4 National trophies to prove it) but, it does get draining when much of the day disappears without getting much actual flying in. I'm not sure what the solution is, and I intend to compete for the 2010 season, but, this has been an interesting thread. Nice to seeya back Teecee!

[mousieo]

Well said TeeCee, no arguments there... Not even on the ham.

I hadn't considered how many of the AKA RDs and Directors have come over to the dark side recently, very true!

Sherri Pigeon, Jim Cosca, Greg Lamoureux, Gayle Woodul, Amy Doran, John Gillespie, Ben Dantonio, makes 7 officers in all...

14 others who aren't "quad fliers" per se, but at least 4-5 are "quad friendly" and receptive to any worthwhile quad ideas.

So, 1/3 of the AKA officers are comprised of people who fly quads (among other kites), very cool indeed.

shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh I am still trying to do it all.. pfffffffft. Ok fine the last time I flew a duelie was at windless last weekend.. and before that, umm October. yikes.

[TeeCee]

Relax, Amy. You do NOT need to start flying duallines unless you WANT to.

Which brings us to yet another asset management scenario.

With multiline flying on the ascendancy, who's to say that there can't be multiline only Regional comps where the local dualline fliers serve as non-competing staff? There is an aspect of reciprocation though; multiline fliers could staff dualline only Regionals. Those that fly both types wouldn't necessarily have to choose one over the other, they can both fly AND staff much like now.

[stevepigeon]

I just had to chime in on this one....

My first major thing..

When I came to the "dark side" and fell in love with flying a kite.. There was no class for me to compete in. The old saying " If you can fly a quad, you can fly in the experienced class" has never sat well with me when we offer a novice class for dual line fliers. Never thought this was fair.. still don't.

It amazes me that we can have 17 fliers in on a Mega fly but can't get 10 fliers to come out to compete. It makes me think... Is the competition side of kiting going to fade into the past?

I like a lot of what John had to say and my quoting skills are not up to par to give you as many examples as I would like. I'm grateful to fliers like John and others that do what they do to at least keep people coming to our festivals.

My opinion...

The younger generation would rather spend their money on the latest Ipod ect than a kite. Having children in their early to late 20's and their Mom, Stepdad and Uncle all being fliers, I can tell you that I have to beg them to come out to the fields. Kiting is more appealing to us big kids.

As to regionals.. They still cost money to pull it off. How many kite clubs have a PA system, field stakes, tape? How many kite clubs can afford AKA and League santioning, field permits.

Another note..

The young ones love the power kiting stuff but without insurance coverage for that class of kiters we can not incorporate them into our festivals.

In this time.. in this moment.. change is coming and it's not sport kite competition.

My $1.00 (due to inflation)

Sherri

[TeeCee]

In this time.. in this moment.. change is coming and it's not sport kite competition.

Sherri

Best of luck standing up your comp in March, Sherri!

I'm good with a growth in recreational flying because that's more numbers for comps when we get our act together again. I kinda see it as the difference between camping and hunting. Camping is relaxation fun, and anybody can go camping. Hunting is fun too, but on a different level and by a smaller, more skilled population than in camping.

And can anybody deny that most inprovements in camping came from hunters? ;-)

[Bazzer]

Best of luck standing up your comp in March, Sherri!

I'm good with a growth in recreational flying because that's more numbers for comps when we get our act together again. I kinda see it as the difference between camping and hunting. Camping is relaxation fun, and anybody can go camping. Hunting is fun too, but on a different level and by a smaller, more skilled population than in camping.

And can anybody deny that most inprovements in camping came from hunters? ;-)

Very True. It leads to equipment progress.
However you don't need to be skilled with a shot gun or kill anything to sleep outside.
It just depends if you need to kill or are you happy enough just to be.
There are always people who want to compete. For them it is how they improve, even a way of life!
I have seen the very best come out of some. Also the very,very worse in me.
At this time I think more people learn from flying, than standing around waiting to fly.
I'm afraid that competition leads to a field with markers in the middle of a beach and a whole load of super intense people slowly watching each other leave because of some latest squabble or rule book. It makes a barrier between the public and the future flyers.
Some may argue that it makes a spectacle for the public. Sure ...show them excellence but show them it is attainable.
In truth, how many rounds of precision have you ever sat through?
Watched it all.....riveted as a spectator. Will you do it again?
If the competition is really what you want. Good for you. Goals are good in life.
If you all need winners medals...well how many do we need.
I'll buy a box.
For me, my life, my kite flying is not measured in tenths of a point, board members, secretaries or minutes of the last meeting.
It's about friends, places and watching new people get that Rev grin.


Bazzer

[Harrier]

Very True. It leads to equipment progress.
However you don't need to be skilled with a shot gun or kill anything to sleep outside.
It just depends if you need to kill or are you happy enough just to be.
There are always people who want to compete. For them it is how they improve, even a way of life!
I have seen the very best come out of some. Also the very,very worse in me.
At this time I think more people learn from flying, than standing around waiting to fly.
I'm afraid that competition leads to a field with markers in the middle of a beach and a whole load of super intense people slowly watching each other leave because of some latest squabble or rule book. It makes a barrier between the public and the future flyers.
Some may argue that it makes a spectacle for the public. Sure ...show them excellence but show them it is attainable.
In truth, how many rounds of precision have you ever sat through?
Watched it all.....riveted as a spectator. Will you do it again?
If the competition is really what you want. Good for you. Goals are good in life.
If you all need winners medals...well how many do we need.
I'll buy a box.
For me, my life, my kite flying is not measured in tenths of a point, board members, secretaries or minutes of the last meeting.
It's about friends, places and watching new people get that Rev grin.


Bazzer

Spot on Bazzer, if kiting wants to attract folk and go forward it needs to be more Red Bull than dead Horse.

[TeeCee]

Aw hell, I was afraid this was gonna happen!

Please consider, folks, that hunting is the skill set which brings you to the point where killing is only a possible outcome. I personally do MY hunting with a camera, where the goal is to get a great shot without the critter du jour even knowing that you're there. Afterwards he goes his way, I go mine.

If you kill something then you have to field-dress it and haul it back to camp, and that's too much like work.

[RevWizard]

Aw hell, I was afraid this was gonna happen!

Please consider, folks, that hunting is the skill set which brings you to the point where killing is only a possible outcome. I personally do MY hunting with a camera, where the goal is to get a great shot without the critter du jour even knowing that you're there. Afterwards he goes his way, I go mine.

If you kill something then you have to field-dress it and haul it back to camp, and that's too much like work.

I will agree with you on that as I have been through both sides. I prefer my trusty camera with a nice long tele.

[Felix Mottram]

<snip>

For me, my life, my kite flying is not measured in tenths of a point, board members, secretaries or minutes of the last meeting.
It's about friends, places and watching new people get that Rev grin.

Bazzer

All very well said and leads me back to a preference for collaboration as opposed to competition.

Look what we managed to achieve at Portsmouth/Bristol, first time out, at that level.

We may, however, have to endure organisational issues at 'some' point!

Felix

[stevepigeon]

Best of luck standing up your comp in March, Sherri!

I'm good with a growth in recreational flying because that's more numbers for comps when we get our act together again. I kinda see it as the difference between camping and hunting. Camping is relaxation fun, and anybody can go camping. Hunting is fun too, but on a different level and by a smaller, more skilled population than in camping.

And can anybody deny that most inprovements in camping came from hunters? ;-)

Due to the lack of intrest in a March competition. There will be none. We only had 6-7 fliers intrested and that doesn't cover the cost. The fact that spring break is here at that time and rooms are full near the location doesn't help either.

[LS Kite Stakes]

I am VERY new to the kiting community, so add salt as needed to the following................

I have never flown in competition, and did not know it existed until last summer when I went to my first festival. For me, as a new community member, competition holds no attraction. As a few have said, quad line has a more community feel to it. It has many more challenges on a personal level in regards to learning the skills needed to actually fly the darned things. The only dual line I have really flown is the old Skynasaur Acrobat that I have had for 25 years. Barring slack line tricks, all I see with duallies is learning to turn right and left at the appropriate times. What has brought me into this community and is keeping me here is the acceptance I have felt from others from the get go. Competition brings out the "I am better than you" mentality that would turn me away in a heartbeat. Be it perceived or real, this is what keeps me away from competing. What does bring me to festivals and "fun flies" is meeting up with like minded people who enjoy kiting for what it is. My hat goes of to the members of iQuad that I have met so far. They are accomplishing the goal of attracting new fliers with down to earth values I wish more people on this ball of rock would show for their fellow human. I would have never guessed I would have become as involved as I have. I will not rule out the possibility of competition for myself in the future, but I need to improve on my skills before I would even think of attempting it. For now, I am having more than enough fun to keep me interested for a long time to come.

[melnsct]

I am VERY new to the kiting community, so add salt as needed to the following................

I have never flown in competition, and did not know it existed until last summer when I went to my first festival. For me, as a new community member, competition holds no attraction. As a few have said, quad line has a more community feel to it. It has many more challenges on a personal level in regards to learning the skills needed to actually fly the darned things. The only dual line I have really flown is the old Skynasaur Acrobat that I have had for 25 years. Barring slack line tricks, all I see with duallies is learning to turn right and left at the appropriate times. What has brought me into this community and is keeping me here is the acceptance I have felt from others from the get go. Competition brings out the "I am better than you" mentality that would turn me away in a heartbeat. Be it perceived or real, this is what keeps me away from competing. What does bring me to festivals and "fun flies" is meeting up with like minded people who enjoy kiting for what it is. My hat goes of to the members of iQuad that I have met so far. They are accomplishing the goal of attracting new fliers with down to earth values I wish more people on this ball of rock would show for their fellow human. I would have never guessed I would have become as involved as I have. I will not rule out the possibility of competition for myself in the future, but I need to improve on my skills before I would even think of attempting it. For now, I am having more than enough fun to keep me interested for a long time to come.

I agree with Walt entirely!!!!
It's about the people and getting better so I can fly more ....with more people!!!!!!!!!!!1