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Race rods vs 3 wrap in a STD kite?


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#1 lasapcheong

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Posted 10 January 2009 - 10:22 AM

Hi,

Earlier I posted a question regarding the choice of race rods vs 3 wrap frame in a VTD sail. Right now I have a similar question but pertaining to a STD sail instead.

http://www.revkites....?showtopic=2054

Say if you have the optimal wind of your choice to use both (6-8 mph glassy smooth), would you rather use the race rods or the 3 wrap? The 3 wrap rods are heavier and coming from the dual line tricking background, typically some of us would prefer a heavier kite as it gives us more momentum for tricking. With Revs, does it help to have a heavier frame (assuming there is enough wind for it) so that it makes momentum based moves (clockwork, pivot turns, stop and go etc) better?

Opinions?


Thanks
Darryl

#2 steveb

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Posted 10 January 2009 - 12:00 PM

I've got Race Rods in one of my B-Series Standards and 3 Wrap Ultralights in the other one.
I tend to fly the Race Rods more often.
I find that unlike on dual line kites, the extra momentum doesn't help me with many of the things that I want to do on a Rev.
It's easier for me to stop/start if there isn't a lot of extra mass.
The one trick that the extra weight seems to help me with is axels.

#3 Jim Dingsdale

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Posted 10 January 2009 - 12:02 PM

Race rods get my nod.

#4 Dean750

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Posted 10 January 2009 - 12:39 PM

Race Rods over the 3 wraps. For one you wouldn't need to change the frame for the lighter winds. Less weight means faster starts and stops. I hate lag.
Axles, at least for me don't seem to matter which frame is in. Maybe with the Flic Flaks. But I think that would only matter on the down rods.
Besides, if you have one (and I don't) I'd think in the 6 mph up to 12 you'd want to be flying the Mid Vent with the Race Frame.

Dean B)

#5 Stone in Shoe Bob

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Posted 10 January 2009 - 02:30 PM

I really don’t want to come across as flippant here but to be frank you can not fly by an anemometer or a text book. What we do is more art than science, science is about getting things right, art is about getting things right for you. It really is a case of suck it and see, if it works do it, if it doesn’t, change it. What works for you today will almost certainly feel wrong for you in six months time in exactly the same conditions because in six months time you will be a different flyer. Leave the anemometer in the drawer and trust the feel of the wind on your skin and the pull on the handles.

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#6 quaa714

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Posted 10 January 2009 - 03:31 PM

Such a subjective topic but...........Race Rods & 120's.........................

When the kite starts to bow too much it's time to switch frames and up the stiffness of the leading edge, or better yet (if you have the ability to) switch to a mid or full vent.

"Cya in the Sand!....."

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#7 jsking

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Posted 10 January 2009 - 04:25 PM

Agreed...I usually get to the field and assess the wind just by feel and decide what rods I want to fly with. This gets real interesting in high winds when I'm putting in multiple LEs, or as I like to call them by adding the two, "Five wraps" or "Seven wraps", etc...(usually on a vented, 'natch). I've yet to reach the point where I fly with "hybrid" frames like a 3-wrap in the LE and 2-wrap verticals or some similar configuration. In that sense I still need to get more "spar smart".

And don't forget, it's not all about the rods...adjustments on the handles and the orientation of the wing contribute to the overall performance of the kite, too.
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#8 quaa714

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Posted 10 January 2009 - 04:35 PM

SNIP.....

And don't forget, it's not all about the rods...adjustments on the handles and the orientation of the wing contribute to the overall performance of the kite, too.


I failed to add in my last post that exact sentiment...

I tend now to fly with very little forward with my top leaders extended out even longer than the standard B leaders.
Harder to launch in lighter winds but so much more comfortable to fly once airborne.

As always, its a personal thing so experimentation is the key.

"Cya in the Sand!....."

"Slack lines are fine lines!"


"You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows" BD
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#9 Aerochic

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Posted 10 January 2009 - 05:13 PM

I agree with Quaa in that you need to find out which rods work best for you, however I find that the Race Rods cover such a wide range of wind conditions that it is what I'd prefer 9 times out of ten.

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#10 Love2fly

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Posted 10 January 2009 - 05:32 PM

What they said... ;)
Definitely feel it out and see what you are comfortable with. It's not right or wrong; it's just what works for you. Personally, I, too, prefer the Race Rods because of the wind range. I find that I change out frames far less often; as a matter of fact, almost never! I even use a Race Frame in my SUL and when there's almost no wind, this awesome Rev seems to jump off the ground!
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#11 Theresa

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Posted 10 January 2009 - 07:16 PM

Hi,

Earlier I posted a question regarding the choice of race rods vs 3 wrap frame in a VTD sail. Right now I have a similar question but pertaining to a STD sail instead.

http://www.revkites....?showtopic=2054

Say if you have the optimal wind of your choice to use both (6-8 mph glassy smooth), would you rather use the race rods or the 3 wrap? The 3 wrap rods are heavier and coming from the dual line tricking background, typically some of us would prefer a heavier kite as it gives us more momentum for tricking. With Revs, does it help to have a heavier frame (assuming there is enough wind for it) so that it makes momentum based moves (clockwork, pivot turns, stop and go etc) better?

Opinions?


Thanks
Darryl


and FYI.....I do have RR in stock.... :) :)....

#12 Sailor99

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Posted 10 January 2009 - 11:52 PM

I agree with Quaa in that you need to find out which rods work best for you, however I find that the Race Rods cover such a wide range of wind conditions that it is what I'd prefer 9 times out of ten.

Agree. In fact I sometimes feel that too much is said about frames and too much changing is done. Personnally i would prefer to be flying. The brain is a fabulously adaptive instrument and will adjust to the same kite set up in a very wide range of winds. The RR will stand up to those winds too, it's range is excellent. If you want a little extra momentum you can easily slot some weights in. You then also have the choice of where to put the weight.

An aside. I wonder if the people changing there frame sets all the time also re-equalize their line sets a lot?
Over - Jeremy

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#13 Jeepster

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Posted 11 January 2009 - 07:11 AM

An aside. I wonder if the people changing there frame sets all the time also re-equalize their line sets a lot?

... that's a completely different affliction.

Cheers,
Tom




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