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Cartwheels across the window?


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#101 RevWizard

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 06:31 AM

Then again, I had wondered about 'rolling the grid'! <gins>

Only a quarter turn one way, you understand...

Felix

Do you mean something like the start of this: http://www.johnnmitc..._v01g-play.html ?

Long John (formerly Mr. R)

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#102 Felix Mottram

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 06:49 AM

Do you mean something like the start of this: http://www.johnnmitc..._v01g-play.html ?


Yes, but that is only 1/8 not 1/4! I'm think that having gone 1/4 in one direction the kites could 180 turn and then do a 1/2!

Felix

#103 Kitelife

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 07:24 AM

What on earth is a moonwalk?

I remember showing the "traveling bicycle" to James Robertshaw at Guadeloupe '97, just before he taught me the Rev axel (during which I sprained my ankle). :)

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#104 RevWizard

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 08:00 AM

What on earth is a moonwalk?

The bicycle, cartwheel and "Hadzicki Shuffle" as far back as I can determine are the same, just different names. None are touching the ground nor as far as I can determine the height off the ground does not really matter. The only exception to this was when there was a compulsory figure in the past that specified that it should be a certain percentage of the wind window above the ground.
The "moonwalk" is movement in the same directions as above with opposite rotations. Left to right, rotate anti-clockwise. Right to left rotate clockwise.

I remember showing the "traveling bicycle" to James Robertshaw at Guadeloupe '97, just before he taught me the Rev axel (during which I sprained my ankle). :)

Yeah, I remember that!
You were hobbling along side on one of my shoulders and James brother Carl was hobbling along on the other.
Two great REV fliers wiped out for a few days.

Long John (formerly Mr. R)

STACK International Executive Committee - 6/1996-6/2008
International Rules Book Committee and STACK International Head Judge - 6/2004-6/2008
World Sport Kite Championship Judge - 2004-2005-2006(Chief Judge)
13x 1st - 12x 2nd - 6x 3rd places in 37 overall Quadline individual competitions


Web Site - http://www.johnnmitchell.com/index.html Check it out today!


#105 bartman

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 08:15 AM

So when ever you guys decide what it's called I am happy to say that today I was able to do some passable stationary bicycle rotationsPosted Image for six to eight rotations before it fell apart:lol:. Very satisfactory to see, I can't await for the across the window spins:rev_clockwork:!


Isn't it great when they start to come together?! Posted Image

I've noticed mine are becoming far more stable and lower to the ground all the time and I can even stop them, most times, in the direction I want to be facing!

Bart

#106 RevWizard

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 10:17 AM

The animation for the bicycle is at: http://gyraphicdesig...icycle_v01.html
The animation for the moonwalk is at: http://gyraphicdesig...onwalk_v01.html

The dreamed up alias "Jackson Shuffle" for the moonwalk, is my doings.

Sometime I will create an actual website for animated quad figures, something like Super16.

Long John (formerly Mr. R)

STACK International Executive Committee - 6/1996-6/2008
International Rules Book Committee and STACK International Head Judge - 6/2004-6/2008
World Sport Kite Championship Judge - 2004-2005-2006(Chief Judge)
13x 1st - 12x 2nd - 6x 3rd places in 37 overall Quadline individual competitions


Web Site - http://www.johnnmitchell.com/index.html Check it out today!


#107 Felix Mottram

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 10:31 AM

<snip>

I've noticed mine are becoming far more stable and lower to the ground all the time and I can even stop them, most times, in the direction I want to be facing!

Bart


Bart,

I want to be able to stop and 'hold position' at any point in the rotation...

I think that this is a key concept.

It is also why I like the idea of copying apparently random movements of other kites, not least in the situation of 'very closely' following another kite!

Felix

#108 bartman

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 10:42 AM

I still am amazed how you kept within inches of me last year at WSIKF. I thought for sure my erratic movement would eventually throw you, but nope!

When the new guy here gets a bit of some simple figure 8's going I'm going to get us flying closer and closer together both to help him with his control and to help me with mine.

Perhaps as I continue practice with clockwork turns I will improve the stationary bicycle spin further too and achieve that stop at any position. I'll add it to the list of things. That list just never gets any shorter!

Bart

#109 Felix Mottram

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 11:20 AM

I still am amazed how you kept within inches of me last year at WSIKF. I thought for sure my erratic movement would eventually throw you, but nope!

<snip>

That list just never gets any shorter!

Bart


The wonder of it is that the list does not get any shorter however long you go on. <grins>

I just want to find the circumstance where it is possible to try new things! The 100 grid thing has become a 'bit' important to me although I am resigned to the financial obstacle to realising that project. Hence consideration of the Super Sixteen or Super 36 possibilities...

Felix

#110 SkyPuppet

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 11:25 AM

The animation for the bicycle is at: http://gyraphicdesig...icycle_v01.html
The animation for the moonwalk is at: http://gyraphicdesig...onwalk_v01.html

The dreamed up alias "Jackson Shuffle" for the moonwalk, is my doings.

Sometime I will create an actual website for animated quad figures, something like Super16.



The animations are fantastic!

I really like "Jackson Shuffle" as a name-variant for the Moonwalk :) It reminds me of the poker hand Jack-5, known in the poker world as "Motown" because of the Jackson Five (Jack-'n-5 lol).

I would like to see all the animations in one website! ;)

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#111 RevWizard

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 11:56 AM

The animations are fantastic!

I really like "Jackson Shuffle" as a name-variant for the Moonwalk :) It reminds me of the poker hand Jack-5, known in the poker world as "Motown" because of the Jackson Five (Jack-'n-5 lol).

I would like to see all the animations in one website! ;)

You can view animations of the ISK Compulsory figures past and present on the Roy Reed Design website.

Long John (formerly Mr. R)

STACK International Executive Committee - 6/1996-6/2008
International Rules Book Committee and STACK International Head Judge - 6/2004-6/2008
World Sport Kite Championship Judge - 2004-2005-2006(Chief Judge)
13x 1st - 12x 2nd - 6x 3rd places in 37 overall Quadline individual competitions


Web Site - http://www.johnnmitchell.com/index.html Check it out today!


#112 SkyPuppet

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 12:01 PM

I've been checking it out for awhile now!! Found it in another topic:

Reed Design - ISKCB this one says 2009..... Is there a 2011 updated version somewhere else on the web?

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#113 Khal

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 12:04 PM

The animation for the bicycle is at: http://gyraphicdesig...icycle_v01.html
The animation for the moonwalk is at: http://gyraphicdesig...onwalk_v01.html

The dreamed up alias "Jackson Shuffle" for the moonwalk, is my doings.

Sometime I will create an actual website for animated quad figures, something like Super16.


Thank you! Those are very useful. It's been a while since I've seen one in person and I was definitely picturing more rotation in the bicycle. I imagine a circle circumscribed around the kite and rotating as though that circle were rolling without slip along a surface (regardless of actual altitiude). When I try it, this leaves me pretty well wound up by the time I cross the window. Prewinding in the opposite direction helps.
Brian

Posted Image Posted Image

#114 RevWizard

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 12:14 PM

Thank you! Those are very useful. It's been a while since I've seen one in person and I was definitely picturing more rotation in the bicycle. I imagine a circle circumscribed around the kite and rotating as though that circle were rolling without slip along a surface (regardless of actual altitiude). When I try it, this leaves me pretty well wound up by the time I cross the window. Prewinding in the opposite direction helps.

The object is simply to rotate and move across the window in a manner somewhat like the animations.
There is no restrictions on how many circles you want to use, nor is there any restriction on the height above the ground.

Now in a competition, specifics would be laid down. At present there is no ISK compulsory figure.

Long John (formerly Mr. R)

STACK International Executive Committee - 6/1996-6/2008
International Rules Book Committee and STACK International Head Judge - 6/2004-6/2008
World Sport Kite Championship Judge - 2004-2005-2006(Chief Judge)
13x 1st - 12x 2nd - 6x 3rd places in 37 overall Quadline individual competitions


Web Site - http://www.johnnmitchell.com/index.html Check it out today!


#115 RevWizard

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 09:55 PM

While thinking about this thread and the Super16 thread, I came up with an idea for a new team figure.
Stay tuned, while I create the animation. Then you can decide whether you like it or if it is even feasible.

Long John (formerly Mr. R)

STACK International Executive Committee - 6/1996-6/2008
International Rules Book Committee and STACK International Head Judge - 6/2004-6/2008
World Sport Kite Championship Judge - 2004-2005-2006(Chief Judge)
13x 1st - 12x 2nd - 6x 3rd places in 37 overall Quadline individual competitions


Web Site - http://www.johnnmitchell.com/index.html Check it out today!


#116 RevWizard

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 12:47 PM

While thinking about this thread and the Super16 thread, I came up with an idea for a new team figure.
Stay tuned, while I create the animation. Then you can decide whether you like it or if it is even feasible.

While fiddling around with this, I found it to be a bit more difficult then I first predicted. However, it is feasible.

Long John (formerly Mr. R)

STACK International Executive Committee - 6/1996-6/2008
International Rules Book Committee and STACK International Head Judge - 6/2004-6/2008
World Sport Kite Championship Judge - 2004-2005-2006(Chief Judge)
13x 1st - 12x 2nd - 6x 3rd places in 37 overall Quadline individual competitions


Web Site - http://www.johnnmitchell.com/index.html Check it out today!


#117 Dutchrev

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 03:20 AM

Hi, is there somewhere a good video or youtube take of the Cartwheels across the window? I searched but found nothing else but text.

Of course the full answer is visit WSIKFPosted Image

THNX
Free in the Sky, flying my Rev

#118 makatakam

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 06:42 AM

Hi, is there somewhere a good video or youtube take of the Cartwheels across the window? I searched but found nothing else but text.

Of course the full answer is visit WSIKFPosted Image

THNX


Go to the videos forum. The first video in the Grand Haven, Michigan festival post (just added recently) has an example of a very good one at about 8:05 in the video.:) It's titled Great Lakes festival.
It's actually a "moonwalk", but when the kite spins in the other direction it's cartwheel. Just noticed -- lokk at the links in SkuPuppet's post about 7 or 8 up from here.
Mark

Posted Image

"...it's a fair wind blowin' warm, out of the south over my shoulder, guess I'll set a course and go."
CSN&Y

#119 bartman

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 12:21 PM

Fiddled with this again today. Tried to put together the various opinions I took home from WSIKF this past August.

I was able to get a rough version going left to right and repeat it 4 times, but I was not able to sort out how I did it. I couldn't do it at all from right to left which is no surprise I have a hard time getting slides to work in that direction too even though I feel I am doing it correct.

I couldn't figure out how I was making it work and when I tried to sort that aspect out I was unable to repeat any of it.

I'm sure I am over-thinking this, but even breaking it down to the smallest components I could think of it still escapes me.

I now consider this the hardest thing I've tried to learn with the kite. I swear it seems like my hands and arms are going to 10 directions at once to make it happen.

Bart

#120 lylenc

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 02:15 PM

Note: in the clock work rotations you time the hands' pushes and pulls to cancel out the side slide and keep the kite in one place in the window during the rotations. For the cartwheel you time the inputs to add emphasis to the horizontal side slide and move the kite across the window during the rotations.

It's best to not think about it. The angle of your wrists stay the same during the side slide pushes and pulls to continue the roations while sliding. If you do have to think, focus on the alternating side slide inputs. Exaggerate the hand pull on the wing that is rotating up from horizontal and reduce the pull (push) on the other wing. This puts your hands in the full side slide position when the leading edge is horizontal and a neutral position (hover hand postion) when the leading edge is vertical.

Work on upright and inverted side slides, with leading edge horizontal. Also work on ground passes in forward and reverse, with the leading edge vertical. For the ground pass, do reverse flight from edge of window to center and add a 180 rotation at the center of the window for forward flight to the opposite edge of the window. Try to do it smoothly without stopping. Eventually add some slide and rotation together for the cartwheel.

For the rotation in the direction of travel, as the trailing wing starts going above horizontal, start adding side slide input with both hands (pull trailing and push leading) so you are in the full side slide hand position when the former trailing wing reaches horizontal position as the leading wing. Start reversing the side slide hand position as the other wing goes above horizontal and you are in full side slide position again when that wing returns to horizontal.

I tried to say the above a couple of ways. Hopefully one of them makes the light bulb glow. Hope it helps rather than confuses thing more.
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Craig
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